Tweet
Official says Abkhazia must not help Georgian party of war by rejecting talks
Regnum, Moscow
8 Aug 05
Abkhaz separatist security council chief Stanislav Lakoba has said
many Georgians are calling for a peaceful settlement of the conflict
and Abkhazia should not help the party of war in Tbilisi by
withdrawing from peace talks. In an interview with the Russian news
agency Regnum, published on 8 August, Lakoba said he believed a
balanced model would be found for Abkhazia, but warned against
attempts to resolve the conflict quickly. He said, however, that
Abkhazia has never left Russia and will not turn its back against
it. The following is an excerpt from the report; sub-headings inserted
editorially:
[Question] Six months have passed since the change of government in
Abkhazia. What are the most important changes in people's lives? What
are the most notable achievements of the new government?
[Lakoba] Whether or not this is a new government is an interesting
question.
Unfortunately, we do not live in a stable European country where a
government's work is evaluated after three months of its coming to
office. The situation in Abkhazia is somewhat different. We live in
completely different conditions to which common democratic norms do
not fully apply just yet. It is inappropriate to draw this sort of
parallel. Relative stability in people's life and in politics is the
most important thing for us and in this regard some progress has been
achieved. [Passage omitted]
Not all Georgians want war
[Question] Does it make sense to hold talks with Georgia given that
the president of that country keeps saying that the only way to
resolve the conflict is to bring Abkhazia back under Georgian control?
[Lakoba] I think we should look at these issues in a broader
context. Why should we help the party of war in Georgia by rejecting
talks? Such a behaviour could weaken the people [in Georgia] standing
on completely different positions. By the way, there are quite a lot
of them. We know that there are people calling for a peaceful
settlement of the conflict. We know that rhetoric may be completely
different from behaviour. No-one rules out the use of force against
Abkhazia, but would this suit the forces behind Georgia and Abkhazia?
This is an important question too. I realize that these forces do not
decide everything. Their position, however, is very important.
Naturally, the president of Georgia can disobey everyone and start
something here of his own accord. It would be a risky move, however,
for him in the first place, as far as I understand. He has already
tried this once, in South Ossetia [reference to Summer 2004]. Everyone
knows what came out of it. This is extremely dangerous, and above all
for the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan [BTC] oil pipeline which was opened with
fanfare not too long ago.
One should not forget that just 101 km separate Tbilisi and Tskhinvali
[South Ossetian capital]. One should not forget about such time bombs
as the Armenian and Azerbaijani enclaves either. There are scores of
other difficult problems.
The example of Turkey is noteworthy in this context. The Kurdish
movement has become active there and the Turkish army is carrying out
punitive operations in the area of the BTC pipeline, trying to
establish order.
I think things are not as simple [as they appear to be]. Frequent
meetings between [Russian President Vladimir] Putin and [Turkish Prime
Minister Recep Tayyip] Erdogan speak volumes. Russia and Turkey have
common interests in the transportation of oil and natural
gas. Attempts by Ukraine and Georgia to transport oil from the port of
Supsa to Odessa run counter to the plans of Russia and
Turkey. Therefore, Ankara realizes that the weakening of Russia will
weaken Turkey itself as Turkey would lose a strategic ally. [Passage
omitted]
Balanced model to be found for Abkhazia
It is hard to say whether we will win independence or create some kind
of a structure with Russia, or a confederation with someone else. It
is one thing to believe that we are independent. Nonetheless, the
international community has to either recognize our independence or
not recognize it. It is hard to say what sort of a model will be
found, but I think that it will be a balanced model.
[Question] What sort of a model would you prefer?
[Lakoba] We have said it many times and it is not just my opinion. The
people expressed their will in the 1999 referendum. Abkhazia is an
independent state and the people of Abkhazia stand on this position.
[Question] You mentioned the possibility of creating a
confederation. Could you be more specific? Which country could
Abkhazia create a confederation with?
[Lakoba] The issue of confederate relations with Georgia was discussed
in Geneva in 1994. At the time we proposed to Georgia that we create a
federation. Georgia responded by attacking us. After the war an idea
of confederation was proposed, but they rejected it as well. Now what?
Should we rejoin Georgia as an autonomous republic? This wouldn't give
us anything.
Some people think the problem of Abkhazia can be solved in a matter of
days, just like the issue of Srpska Krajina. This is absurd. The
situation may descend into chaos, first in Russia and then in the
whole of Caucasus. All of this will question the viability of
mega-projects, including the oil pipelines. By and large, as far as
energy is concerned, the USA is not interested in Abkhazia. It lies
off the routes of major projects.
One thing that may not be in America's interest is an increased
regional influence of Russia. It is in this context that one should
look at their position on the restoration of train services through
Abkhazia, which is widely discussed. This jeopardizes America's plans
because it runs counter to the idea of the East-West transport
corridor. The same is true for the Russian-Iranian project North-South
which does not fit in with the removal of Russian bases from Georgia
in any way. There are plans to remove Russian troops from Armenia as
well. It is no accident that the American embassy in Armenia is the
second largest in the world. The proximity of Iran has played a major
role here. There was a joke - a railway to Yerevan is a railway to
Tehran.
I think the restoration of transit rail services through Abkhazia will
be torpedoed. This issue does not fit in the deal.
[Question] Is Abkhazia ready to discuss a confederation with Georgia?
[Lakoba] How can we discuss this sort of issue given Georgia's
militaristic rhetoric you mentioned?
[Question] Do the Abkhaz people support these views?
[Lakoba] Yes, of course.
[Question] What about members of the government?
[Lakoba] Yes, they do.
Russia not ready to incorporate Abkhazia
[Question] Would it not be easier for Abkhazia to join Russia and
ensure its security in this way? The issue would have been closed.
[Lakoba] How would Russia do this? In what way? Abkhazia has appealed
to Russia many times. I think it is not realistic.
[Question] Who is it not realistic for, Russia or Abkhazia?
[Lakoba] Right now, it is not realistic for Russia.
[Passage omitted: Lakoba's views on world politics; nothing terrible
will happen even if Russia leaves]
[Question] Who will be responsible if misfortunes befall Abkhazia? Who
is responsible for the slogan Independent Abkhazia? Independence is a
beautiful thing, but can it ensure the security and wellbeing of the
Abkhaz people? Things may go wrong. For example, Russia may close its
border with Abkhazia.
[Lakoba] Of course, this may happen. No-one rules out such a
scenario. It is difficult, however, to see the real picture. We are in
the middle of a complex web of contradictions, cut off from true
information. We know only a little bit of what is happening. There are
other things, however, we can only guess about.
We know which way to sail. We realize the problems. We understand that
the situation in Russia isn't simple.
Besides, Abkhazia has never left Russia. I have already said this. You
can refer to the complete set of laws published in 1810. We have been
in the orbit of cultural, military, political, economic and language
relations with Russia for 200 years. It is absurd to demand that our
people turn their back against their big neighbour. [Passage omitted]
From: Emil Lazarian | Ararat NewsPress
Regnum, Moscow
8 Aug 05
Abkhaz separatist security council chief Stanislav Lakoba has said
many Georgians are calling for a peaceful settlement of the conflict
and Abkhazia should not help the party of war in Tbilisi by
withdrawing from peace talks. In an interview with the Russian news
agency Regnum, published on 8 August, Lakoba said he believed a
balanced model would be found for Abkhazia, but warned against
attempts to resolve the conflict quickly. He said, however, that
Abkhazia has never left Russia and will not turn its back against
it. The following is an excerpt from the report; sub-headings inserted
editorially:
[Question] Six months have passed since the change of government in
Abkhazia. What are the most important changes in people's lives? What
are the most notable achievements of the new government?
[Lakoba] Whether or not this is a new government is an interesting
question.
Unfortunately, we do not live in a stable European country where a
government's work is evaluated after three months of its coming to
office. The situation in Abkhazia is somewhat different. We live in
completely different conditions to which common democratic norms do
not fully apply just yet. It is inappropriate to draw this sort of
parallel. Relative stability in people's life and in politics is the
most important thing for us and in this regard some progress has been
achieved. [Passage omitted]
Not all Georgians want war
[Question] Does it make sense to hold talks with Georgia given that
the president of that country keeps saying that the only way to
resolve the conflict is to bring Abkhazia back under Georgian control?
[Lakoba] I think we should look at these issues in a broader
context. Why should we help the party of war in Georgia by rejecting
talks? Such a behaviour could weaken the people [in Georgia] standing
on completely different positions. By the way, there are quite a lot
of them. We know that there are people calling for a peaceful
settlement of the conflict. We know that rhetoric may be completely
different from behaviour. No-one rules out the use of force against
Abkhazia, but would this suit the forces behind Georgia and Abkhazia?
This is an important question too. I realize that these forces do not
decide everything. Their position, however, is very important.
Naturally, the president of Georgia can disobey everyone and start
something here of his own accord. It would be a risky move, however,
for him in the first place, as far as I understand. He has already
tried this once, in South Ossetia [reference to Summer 2004]. Everyone
knows what came out of it. This is extremely dangerous, and above all
for the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan [BTC] oil pipeline which was opened with
fanfare not too long ago.
One should not forget that just 101 km separate Tbilisi and Tskhinvali
[South Ossetian capital]. One should not forget about such time bombs
as the Armenian and Azerbaijani enclaves either. There are scores of
other difficult problems.
The example of Turkey is noteworthy in this context. The Kurdish
movement has become active there and the Turkish army is carrying out
punitive operations in the area of the BTC pipeline, trying to
establish order.
I think things are not as simple [as they appear to be]. Frequent
meetings between [Russian President Vladimir] Putin and [Turkish Prime
Minister Recep Tayyip] Erdogan speak volumes. Russia and Turkey have
common interests in the transportation of oil and natural
gas. Attempts by Ukraine and Georgia to transport oil from the port of
Supsa to Odessa run counter to the plans of Russia and
Turkey. Therefore, Ankara realizes that the weakening of Russia will
weaken Turkey itself as Turkey would lose a strategic ally. [Passage
omitted]
Balanced model to be found for Abkhazia
It is hard to say whether we will win independence or create some kind
of a structure with Russia, or a confederation with someone else. It
is one thing to believe that we are independent. Nonetheless, the
international community has to either recognize our independence or
not recognize it. It is hard to say what sort of a model will be
found, but I think that it will be a balanced model.
[Question] What sort of a model would you prefer?
[Lakoba] We have said it many times and it is not just my opinion. The
people expressed their will in the 1999 referendum. Abkhazia is an
independent state and the people of Abkhazia stand on this position.
[Question] You mentioned the possibility of creating a
confederation. Could you be more specific? Which country could
Abkhazia create a confederation with?
[Lakoba] The issue of confederate relations with Georgia was discussed
in Geneva in 1994. At the time we proposed to Georgia that we create a
federation. Georgia responded by attacking us. After the war an idea
of confederation was proposed, but they rejected it as well. Now what?
Should we rejoin Georgia as an autonomous republic? This wouldn't give
us anything.
Some people think the problem of Abkhazia can be solved in a matter of
days, just like the issue of Srpska Krajina. This is absurd. The
situation may descend into chaos, first in Russia and then in the
whole of Caucasus. All of this will question the viability of
mega-projects, including the oil pipelines. By and large, as far as
energy is concerned, the USA is not interested in Abkhazia. It lies
off the routes of major projects.
One thing that may not be in America's interest is an increased
regional influence of Russia. It is in this context that one should
look at their position on the restoration of train services through
Abkhazia, which is widely discussed. This jeopardizes America's plans
because it runs counter to the idea of the East-West transport
corridor. The same is true for the Russian-Iranian project North-South
which does not fit in with the removal of Russian bases from Georgia
in any way. There are plans to remove Russian troops from Armenia as
well. It is no accident that the American embassy in Armenia is the
second largest in the world. The proximity of Iran has played a major
role here. There was a joke - a railway to Yerevan is a railway to
Tehran.
I think the restoration of transit rail services through Abkhazia will
be torpedoed. This issue does not fit in the deal.
[Question] Is Abkhazia ready to discuss a confederation with Georgia?
[Lakoba] How can we discuss this sort of issue given Georgia's
militaristic rhetoric you mentioned?
[Question] Do the Abkhaz people support these views?
[Lakoba] Yes, of course.
[Question] What about members of the government?
[Lakoba] Yes, they do.
Russia not ready to incorporate Abkhazia
[Question] Would it not be easier for Abkhazia to join Russia and
ensure its security in this way? The issue would have been closed.
[Lakoba] How would Russia do this? In what way? Abkhazia has appealed
to Russia many times. I think it is not realistic.
[Question] Who is it not realistic for, Russia or Abkhazia?
[Lakoba] Right now, it is not realistic for Russia.
[Passage omitted: Lakoba's views on world politics; nothing terrible
will happen even if Russia leaves]
[Question] Who will be responsible if misfortunes befall Abkhazia? Who
is responsible for the slogan Independent Abkhazia? Independence is a
beautiful thing, but can it ensure the security and wellbeing of the
Abkhaz people? Things may go wrong. For example, Russia may close its
border with Abkhazia.
[Lakoba] Of course, this may happen. No-one rules out such a
scenario. It is difficult, however, to see the real picture. We are in
the middle of a complex web of contradictions, cut off from true
information. We know only a little bit of what is happening. There are
other things, however, we can only guess about.
We know which way to sail. We realize the problems. We understand that
the situation in Russia isn't simple.
Besides, Abkhazia has never left Russia. I have already said this. You
can refer to the complete set of laws published in 1810. We have been
in the orbit of cultural, military, political, economic and language
relations with Russia for 200 years. It is absurd to demand that our
people turn their back against their big neighbour. [Passage omitted]
From: Emil Lazarian | Ararat NewsPress