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Hayots Ashkhar Daily
29 Aug 2008
Armenia
PRESIDENT SERGE SARGSYAN'S INTERVIEW TO THE TURKISH "RADICAL" DAILY
"May the September 6 football match between the Armenian and Turkish
national representative teams be viewed as the most politicized
sporting event in our region? What political expectations did you
have when you invited Turkish President Abdullah Gyul to Armenia for
watching the match together?"
"My principal goal was the regulation of the relations between the
two countries. In his congratulatory message addressed to me on the
occasion of being elected to the post of President, Mr. Gyul spoke
about the possibility of developing the relationship. Later, Prime
Minister Erdoghan expressed his opinion on the necessity of having
the doors open for a dialogue.
In response to that, I decided to take advantage of such
opportunity. There is a good sporting event in store for us. Our
national football teams are going to meet with each other for the
first time in history. This may serve as a good occasion for the
development of our relations. It doesn't matter what result will be
recorded, but I hope that the audience will enjoy the match. There's
going to be a great enthusiasm. This meeting will be an exceptional
event in our relations, and I hope that it will=2 0become much more
exceptional in the presence of the Armenian and Turkish presidents.
We are neighbors and will continue to remain as neighbors. I
believe that having normal relations will be more useful to the two
peoples. And my invitation sent to Mr. Gyul should be viewed in that
particular context."
"There are certain fears in Ankara in connection with the
above-mentioned invitation; for instance, the problem of the borders
and the issue as to what reception Mr. Gyul will find in Yerevan. Do
you have such concerns?"
"There can be no concerns with regard to the organizational issues. If
we have invited a country's president, we will take all the measure
to receive Mr. Gyul in a manner appropriate to such kinds of visits."
"I have had a meeting with Dashnaktsoutyun party, and they are against
your invitation. They say they will take all the possible measures
to make Mr. Gyul hear their voice in case he arrives in Armenia."
"I don't think the measures aimed at raising one's voice will go
beyond the frameworks acceptable to official visits. The attempts of
demonstrating an uncivilized attitude will be first of all directed
against the Republic of Armenia and me, because I am the inviting
party."
"What is your opinion on the current regional projects in the spheres
of energy and communication? These are projects that may lead to
prosperity in case of peace and stability in the region. Will Armenia
choose to join them? Do you think you will be received in Turkey the
same way as the leaders of Georgia and Azerbaijan, and the Turkish
leaders will accept the invitation received from Yerevan without
hesitation?"
"You know, I have learnt two lessons from the regional projects
implemented so far. First, if not all the countries in the region
are involved in the projects or one of the countries is excluded,
there emerge new lines of demarcation. Second, when the political
considerations in such projects prevail over the economic ones, they
never become successful enough. It's like putting the cart before
the horse."
"Which project do you mean?"
"For instance, the Baku-Tbilisi-Kars railroad. A lot of means are
spent for excluding Armenia from the project. The Armenian leaders
visited Turkey in the past. I have also visited that country in
different capacities. Let me add that the mutual visits of neighbors
are a normal phenomenon, and that shouldn't be perceived as a sign
of courtesy to the opposite party. Our efforts are directed to that."
"While launching the construction of the Baku-Tbilisi-Kars railroad,
Abdullah Gyul said in the presence of Presidents Aliev and Sahakashvili
that Armenia may participate in regional programs provided it respects
the principles of internati onal law. Do you think he meant the
borderline approved by the 1921 Kars Treaty?"
"I think if you ask that question to Mr. Gyul, he will give a more
precise answer. The only thing I can say is that Armenia is for the UN
Charter and a number of other international treaties, and it respects
its international commitments."
"Let me formulate my question more clearly. There are certain circles
in Armenia that give the name Western Armenia to a territory which
forms part of Turkey and have territorial claims under the Treaty of
Sevre. Do you admit that it is difficult to establish full diplomatic
relations with a country that has arguments as to your borders? What
is your viewpoint, i.e.
official attitude with regard to the legality and recognition of the
Kars Treaty?"
"I don't remember any Armenian official expressing any opinion about
territorial claims. But I hear that from the opposite party. I don't
think it is right to assume the statements made by separate individuals
as a basis. If we follow that approach, we may believe the viewpoint
expressed by some people in Turkey that there is actually no country
called Armenia.
We don't want any preconditions in our relations with Turkey. I also
hear Turkish officials express concerns on Eastern-Western Armenia,
and it sounds very strange to me. Those are geographical terms used
since the end of the 1 9th century. Forgetting and obliterating the
expression coming from the past in a persistent manner is the same
as denying the existence of Sparta, the Russian Empire, the Ottoman
Empire and a number of historical-geographical terms. If that were
our official policy, our country would be called the Republic of
Eastern Armenia instead of Republic of Armenia.
No Armenian official has ever insisted on anything of the kind. In
case of establishing diplomatic relations, it will be easier to
discuss those issues. For example, Russia used to have problems of
borders with either China or Japan; however, this is not an obstacle
to diplomatic relations."
"After you sent an invitation to Mr. Gyul, there occurred
serious developments in the Caucasus, such as the Georgian-Russian
conflict. What is your opinion on Russia's policy of supporting South
Ossetia and Abkhazia which are seceding from Georgia?"
"As a matter of fact, there occurred tragic events; there were human
losses. This showed once again what an arms race may lead to in
such matters.
We are for resolving such matters through negotiations. We are for
respecting the right to self-determination expressed by the free
will of the peoples. It is regrettable that the situation is becoming
exacerbated, and we do not approve of that.
We do believe that the implementation of the program initiated jointly
by the RF Presidents D. Medvedev and French President N. Sarkozy will
lead to peace and stability. Peace and stability are very important
to us. Putting aside all the other issues, let me note that more than
70 % of our trade is carried out via the territory of Georgia."
Hayots Ashkhar Daily
29 Aug 2008
Armenia
PRESIDENT SERGE SARGSYAN'S INTERVIEW TO THE TURKISH "RADICAL" DAILY
"May the September 6 football match between the Armenian and Turkish
national representative teams be viewed as the most politicized
sporting event in our region? What political expectations did you
have when you invited Turkish President Abdullah Gyul to Armenia for
watching the match together?"
"My principal goal was the regulation of the relations between the
two countries. In his congratulatory message addressed to me on the
occasion of being elected to the post of President, Mr. Gyul spoke
about the possibility of developing the relationship. Later, Prime
Minister Erdoghan expressed his opinion on the necessity of having
the doors open for a dialogue.
In response to that, I decided to take advantage of such
opportunity. There is a good sporting event in store for us. Our
national football teams are going to meet with each other for the
first time in history. This may serve as a good occasion for the
development of our relations. It doesn't matter what result will be
recorded, but I hope that the audience will enjoy the match. There's
going to be a great enthusiasm. This meeting will be an exceptional
event in our relations, and I hope that it will=2 0become much more
exceptional in the presence of the Armenian and Turkish presidents.
We are neighbors and will continue to remain as neighbors. I
believe that having normal relations will be more useful to the two
peoples. And my invitation sent to Mr. Gyul should be viewed in that
particular context."
"There are certain fears in Ankara in connection with the
above-mentioned invitation; for instance, the problem of the borders
and the issue as to what reception Mr. Gyul will find in Yerevan. Do
you have such concerns?"
"There can be no concerns with regard to the organizational issues. If
we have invited a country's president, we will take all the measure
to receive Mr. Gyul in a manner appropriate to such kinds of visits."
"I have had a meeting with Dashnaktsoutyun party, and they are against
your invitation. They say they will take all the possible measures
to make Mr. Gyul hear their voice in case he arrives in Armenia."
"I don't think the measures aimed at raising one's voice will go
beyond the frameworks acceptable to official visits. The attempts of
demonstrating an uncivilized attitude will be first of all directed
against the Republic of Armenia and me, because I am the inviting
party."
"What is your opinion on the current regional projects in the spheres
of energy and communication? These are projects that may lead to
prosperity in case of peace and stability in the region. Will Armenia
choose to join them? Do you think you will be received in Turkey the
same way as the leaders of Georgia and Azerbaijan, and the Turkish
leaders will accept the invitation received from Yerevan without
hesitation?"
"You know, I have learnt two lessons from the regional projects
implemented so far. First, if not all the countries in the region
are involved in the projects or one of the countries is excluded,
there emerge new lines of demarcation. Second, when the political
considerations in such projects prevail over the economic ones, they
never become successful enough. It's like putting the cart before
the horse."
"Which project do you mean?"
"For instance, the Baku-Tbilisi-Kars railroad. A lot of means are
spent for excluding Armenia from the project. The Armenian leaders
visited Turkey in the past. I have also visited that country in
different capacities. Let me add that the mutual visits of neighbors
are a normal phenomenon, and that shouldn't be perceived as a sign
of courtesy to the opposite party. Our efforts are directed to that."
"While launching the construction of the Baku-Tbilisi-Kars railroad,
Abdullah Gyul said in the presence of Presidents Aliev and Sahakashvili
that Armenia may participate in regional programs provided it respects
the principles of internati onal law. Do you think he meant the
borderline approved by the 1921 Kars Treaty?"
"I think if you ask that question to Mr. Gyul, he will give a more
precise answer. The only thing I can say is that Armenia is for the UN
Charter and a number of other international treaties, and it respects
its international commitments."
"Let me formulate my question more clearly. There are certain circles
in Armenia that give the name Western Armenia to a territory which
forms part of Turkey and have territorial claims under the Treaty of
Sevre. Do you admit that it is difficult to establish full diplomatic
relations with a country that has arguments as to your borders? What
is your viewpoint, i.e.
official attitude with regard to the legality and recognition of the
Kars Treaty?"
"I don't remember any Armenian official expressing any opinion about
territorial claims. But I hear that from the opposite party. I don't
think it is right to assume the statements made by separate individuals
as a basis. If we follow that approach, we may believe the viewpoint
expressed by some people in Turkey that there is actually no country
called Armenia.
We don't want any preconditions in our relations with Turkey. I also
hear Turkish officials express concerns on Eastern-Western Armenia,
and it sounds very strange to me. Those are geographical terms used
since the end of the 1 9th century. Forgetting and obliterating the
expression coming from the past in a persistent manner is the same
as denying the existence of Sparta, the Russian Empire, the Ottoman
Empire and a number of historical-geographical terms. If that were
our official policy, our country would be called the Republic of
Eastern Armenia instead of Republic of Armenia.
No Armenian official has ever insisted on anything of the kind. In
case of establishing diplomatic relations, it will be easier to
discuss those issues. For example, Russia used to have problems of
borders with either China or Japan; however, this is not an obstacle
to diplomatic relations."
"After you sent an invitation to Mr. Gyul, there occurred
serious developments in the Caucasus, such as the Georgian-Russian
conflict. What is your opinion on Russia's policy of supporting South
Ossetia and Abkhazia which are seceding from Georgia?"
"As a matter of fact, there occurred tragic events; there were human
losses. This showed once again what an arms race may lead to in
such matters.
We are for resolving such matters through negotiations. We are for
respecting the right to self-determination expressed by the free
will of the peoples. It is regrettable that the situation is becoming
exacerbated, and we do not approve of that.
We do believe that the implementation of the program initiated jointly
by the RF Presidents D. Medvedev and French President N. Sarkozy will
lead to peace and stability. Peace and stability are very important
to us. Putting aside all the other issues, let me note that more than
70 % of our trade is carried out via the territory of Georgia."