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VARVITSIOTES VS. GEDEON: DEBATING AN ARTICLE ON THE HOLOCAUST IN GREECE
Greek News
http://www.greeknewsonline.com/modules.php?na me=News&file=article&sid=8031
Feb 4 2008
New York
New York.- Orestes Varvitsiotesʼ featured article "The tragic
events of the Holocaust and Greek Christiansʼ help to the Jews",
published in the GreekNews (1/21/2008) was received warmly by all our
readers, who praised the writer for a very balanced description and
analysis of the tragic events of that period. All but one; Mr George
Gedeon, "a Canadian news and current affairs video editor of Greek
(non-Jewish) descent. Mr Gedeon - whose articles are frequently
used to support criticism against Greece and Greeks for not doing
enough on the issue of anti-Semitism by the Helsinki Watch and other
organizations - in a comment widely distributed criticizes Orestes
Varvitsiotesʼ article as "feel good article about one side of
the Holocaust in Greece.
George Gideonʼs views received some very negative comments from
prominent Greek Jews who think that "we better ignore his obsession".
Greek News feels that because of the extensive debate thatʼs
already taken place on the internet, we should at least publish Mr
Gedeonʼs comments and Mr Varvitsiotesʼ reply.
GEORGE GEDEON This is a "nice" and "feel-good" article about one
side of the Holocaust in Greece. It also puts most of the blame on
the Jewish leadership while over all exonerates the responsibility
of many gentile Greeks for the economic and physical destruction of
Greek Jewry.
I also noticed that most of the author's research comes from
non-critical sources-with the exception of In Memoriam. He never read
Mazower's 3 books on the topic, Fred Reed's "Salonika Terminus",
Caplan's "Balkan Ghosts", Matsas' "Illusion of Safety" or Yamtov
Yakoel's diary.
Although he does mention Simeonidis and the Mayor of Kerkyra, he does
not tell us that most Greek Jews were rounded up, guarded and put on
trains and trucks with the co-operation of Greek gendarmes. He also
does not mention that no Greek politician resigned over the Eleftherias
Square events or deportations all over Greece, nor gives us details
of the vast and shameful exploitation of Jewish businesses by locals.
Under "Other events" he mentions something about the destruction of
the Salonika Jewish cemetery, but no details... It was the Germans
that "recommended" and the Greeks that accepted the vast real estate
as a ransom for the release of Jewish slave labourers inside Greece.
It was also Greek municipal crews that dug-up the cemetery and used
its stones for the construction and repairs of homes, churches and
sidewalks, many still visible in the city.
Most of the article involves Thessaloniki, an easy target for
"feel-good", mainstream Greek historians because of Koretz, the Jewish
civil police and lack of integration, but does not explain how and
why did the Romaniote (Greek speaking) Jews got it almost as bad as
the Sephardim (exceptions of Volos, Trikala, Larissa and Zakynthos)
Yes, some Jewish leaders co-operated with the Germans because : 1)
The Germans and the Greek authorities had them convinced they were
going to live in a Polish "Jewish town".
2) They had no choice. They were constantly warned of "extreme
consequences" for themselves and their communities.
3) They had no solid advice or support from the collaborationist
politicians and mass media.
In my opinion, this article is another attempt to excuse Greek
gentiles, especially those with the means and authority, for what
they did or did not do to help.
It is time that we began to include in our discussions, commemorations
and literature the other side of the coin. It serves no purpose to
hide our heads in the sand. We owe it to the 60,000 Jewish Greeks that
perished in the death camps and the new generations of Greeks of all
faiths. If they are to understand how that human catastrophe could have
happened in Europe, then we must include all its embarrassing details.
Respectfully George Gedeon Toronto.
Orestes Varvitsiotes >>From my previous dealings with George Gedeon,
I have come to wonder not only as to his motives, but also of his
ability to judge correctly. And I am very pleased that this time he
did not insinuate that I am an anti-Semite!
To begin with, what I wrote is an article (not a book) about a specific
subject with limited and well defined parameters: The Tragic Events
of the Holocaust and the Greek Christians Help to the Jews.
Period. So let us see what he is talking about here:
No one in his right mind will call my article a "feel-good", and
neither do I put the blame for what happened on the Jewish leadership,
beyond the fact that I mention the way they decided to act in the
face of their predicament. He would have preferred me not to allude
to it, as some Greek-Americans scolded me for mentioning the incident
at Kerkyra, because, they say, it was not indicative of the Greek
people but only of a bunch of Nazi collaborators. Mr.
Gedeon, however, shifts the blame to the Greek population at large! A
friend of mine, a Jewish professor, even thought I came down too hard
on Simonides who used the empty Jewish houses to shelter the Greek
refugees from the Bulgarian Sector.
He states that my sources are not to his liking and he mentions some
books of his own. I can claim I have read more books that Mr. Gedeon: I
just donated 45 books about the Greek Jewry to the Center of Byzantine
and Modern Greek Studies at Queens College, where Professor Bowman
teaches a course. Rae Dalvenʼs book on the Jews of Ioannina is
by far the best, and Nikos Stravroulakis has spent his entire life
researching on the Jews of Greece (and not only Crete).
Instead, Mr. Gedeon suggests the book Robert Kaplan wrote, which
I have read and is pure trash; As for Mr. Kaplan himself, he is so
enamored with Ataturk and the Turkish Generals that he urged General
Musharaff of Pakistan to emulate him. He did, and look what is
happening to Pakistan now! As for Yakoelʼs diary (which I have
read) itʼs nothing but a condemnation of Rabbi Koretz policies,
and this is long before their catastrophic results became evident. I
have also read Matsasʼ book, but not the other he mentions.
Therefore, my sources are as authoritative as they could be, and let
Mr. Gedeon tell us why they are not.
The Greek police also rounded Greeks of the Resistance, including
my mother, following German orders. This may not be an excuse,
but there were Greek collaborators as well as Jewish collaborators,
and there is no difference between them. Yakoel and his family were
betrayed by a Jew. On the other hand, it was the chief of police
at Katerini who saved the Jews! Now how can I answer that no Greek
politician resigned...is he for real? The Quisling Prime Minister,
Logothetopoulos, however, did try to intervene on behalf of the Jews,
which is very unusual (and commendable) for a man in his position.
Contrast this with General Petainʼs government at Vichy.
The Germans dug up the cemetery; what did he expect-the Greeks to put
it back? (To turn the tables) Did the Jewish communities in Istanbul,
New York or Toronto protest the Turkish pogrom in Istanbul on September
6, 1955, when 73 churches, 8 cemeteries, 26 schools, 1,004 homes,
4,212 shops and stores, 21 factories, 12 hotels, 97 restaurants,
and 23 warehouses were destroyed?
The article involves Thessaloniki not because "it is an easy target",
as Mr Gedeon purports in an attempt to twist my motives, but because
it is there where out of 46,000 people only 1950 survived! The
Jews at Jannina got it as badly, and for the same reasons as in
Thessaloniki-and it is mentioned in the article. Contrast this with the
Warsaw Ghetto uprising and the prisonersʼ uprising in Auschwitz
(or is it Birkenau?).
This article had no ulterior motives to please or displease anyone,
Greek or Jew. I honestly tried to recreate for the general public
these horrific events, to impart the meaning and the lessons of
the Holocaust.
Mr Gedeon absurdly refuses to accept the fact that those Jews who
survived, survived due to the assistance they received from their
fellow Greek Christians-a very shameful position. Let Mr. Gedeon tell
us: In what other country did the Church and Resistance do more for
the Jews than in Greece?
It is obvious that what displeases Mr. Gedeon is that my article is at
odds with the agenda of an influential segment of the Jewish-American
elites, who have become the mouthpieces of the Turkish Generals in
the Halls of Congress and elsewhere. It is they who shamefully have
been instrumental in the denial of the Pontian and Armenian Genocides,
an insult and a dishonor to the memory of the Jewish victims of the
Holocaust themselves. Mr. Gedeon has appointed himself as the arbiter
of what is politically-correct (according to his agenda), not what
is factually true. His anti-Hellenism is obvious, as it is odious!
Greek News
http://www.greeknewsonline.com/modules.php?na me=News&file=article&sid=8031
Feb 4 2008
New York
New York.- Orestes Varvitsiotesʼ featured article "The tragic
events of the Holocaust and Greek Christiansʼ help to the Jews",
published in the GreekNews (1/21/2008) was received warmly by all our
readers, who praised the writer for a very balanced description and
analysis of the tragic events of that period. All but one; Mr George
Gedeon, "a Canadian news and current affairs video editor of Greek
(non-Jewish) descent. Mr Gedeon - whose articles are frequently
used to support criticism against Greece and Greeks for not doing
enough on the issue of anti-Semitism by the Helsinki Watch and other
organizations - in a comment widely distributed criticizes Orestes
Varvitsiotesʼ article as "feel good article about one side of
the Holocaust in Greece.
George Gideonʼs views received some very negative comments from
prominent Greek Jews who think that "we better ignore his obsession".
Greek News feels that because of the extensive debate thatʼs
already taken place on the internet, we should at least publish Mr
Gedeonʼs comments and Mr Varvitsiotesʼ reply.
GEORGE GEDEON This is a "nice" and "feel-good" article about one
side of the Holocaust in Greece. It also puts most of the blame on
the Jewish leadership while over all exonerates the responsibility
of many gentile Greeks for the economic and physical destruction of
Greek Jewry.
I also noticed that most of the author's research comes from
non-critical sources-with the exception of In Memoriam. He never read
Mazower's 3 books on the topic, Fred Reed's "Salonika Terminus",
Caplan's "Balkan Ghosts", Matsas' "Illusion of Safety" or Yamtov
Yakoel's diary.
Although he does mention Simeonidis and the Mayor of Kerkyra, he does
not tell us that most Greek Jews were rounded up, guarded and put on
trains and trucks with the co-operation of Greek gendarmes. He also
does not mention that no Greek politician resigned over the Eleftherias
Square events or deportations all over Greece, nor gives us details
of the vast and shameful exploitation of Jewish businesses by locals.
Under "Other events" he mentions something about the destruction of
the Salonika Jewish cemetery, but no details... It was the Germans
that "recommended" and the Greeks that accepted the vast real estate
as a ransom for the release of Jewish slave labourers inside Greece.
It was also Greek municipal crews that dug-up the cemetery and used
its stones for the construction and repairs of homes, churches and
sidewalks, many still visible in the city.
Most of the article involves Thessaloniki, an easy target for
"feel-good", mainstream Greek historians because of Koretz, the Jewish
civil police and lack of integration, but does not explain how and
why did the Romaniote (Greek speaking) Jews got it almost as bad as
the Sephardim (exceptions of Volos, Trikala, Larissa and Zakynthos)
Yes, some Jewish leaders co-operated with the Germans because : 1)
The Germans and the Greek authorities had them convinced they were
going to live in a Polish "Jewish town".
2) They had no choice. They were constantly warned of "extreme
consequences" for themselves and their communities.
3) They had no solid advice or support from the collaborationist
politicians and mass media.
In my opinion, this article is another attempt to excuse Greek
gentiles, especially those with the means and authority, for what
they did or did not do to help.
It is time that we began to include in our discussions, commemorations
and literature the other side of the coin. It serves no purpose to
hide our heads in the sand. We owe it to the 60,000 Jewish Greeks that
perished in the death camps and the new generations of Greeks of all
faiths. If they are to understand how that human catastrophe could have
happened in Europe, then we must include all its embarrassing details.
Respectfully George Gedeon Toronto.
Orestes Varvitsiotes >>From my previous dealings with George Gedeon,
I have come to wonder not only as to his motives, but also of his
ability to judge correctly. And I am very pleased that this time he
did not insinuate that I am an anti-Semite!
To begin with, what I wrote is an article (not a book) about a specific
subject with limited and well defined parameters: The Tragic Events
of the Holocaust and the Greek Christians Help to the Jews.
Period. So let us see what he is talking about here:
No one in his right mind will call my article a "feel-good", and
neither do I put the blame for what happened on the Jewish leadership,
beyond the fact that I mention the way they decided to act in the
face of their predicament. He would have preferred me not to allude
to it, as some Greek-Americans scolded me for mentioning the incident
at Kerkyra, because, they say, it was not indicative of the Greek
people but only of a bunch of Nazi collaborators. Mr.
Gedeon, however, shifts the blame to the Greek population at large! A
friend of mine, a Jewish professor, even thought I came down too hard
on Simonides who used the empty Jewish houses to shelter the Greek
refugees from the Bulgarian Sector.
He states that my sources are not to his liking and he mentions some
books of his own. I can claim I have read more books that Mr. Gedeon: I
just donated 45 books about the Greek Jewry to the Center of Byzantine
and Modern Greek Studies at Queens College, where Professor Bowman
teaches a course. Rae Dalvenʼs book on the Jews of Ioannina is
by far the best, and Nikos Stravroulakis has spent his entire life
researching on the Jews of Greece (and not only Crete).
Instead, Mr. Gedeon suggests the book Robert Kaplan wrote, which
I have read and is pure trash; As for Mr. Kaplan himself, he is so
enamored with Ataturk and the Turkish Generals that he urged General
Musharaff of Pakistan to emulate him. He did, and look what is
happening to Pakistan now! As for Yakoelʼs diary (which I have
read) itʼs nothing but a condemnation of Rabbi Koretz policies,
and this is long before their catastrophic results became evident. I
have also read Matsasʼ book, but not the other he mentions.
Therefore, my sources are as authoritative as they could be, and let
Mr. Gedeon tell us why they are not.
The Greek police also rounded Greeks of the Resistance, including
my mother, following German orders. This may not be an excuse,
but there were Greek collaborators as well as Jewish collaborators,
and there is no difference between them. Yakoel and his family were
betrayed by a Jew. On the other hand, it was the chief of police
at Katerini who saved the Jews! Now how can I answer that no Greek
politician resigned...is he for real? The Quisling Prime Minister,
Logothetopoulos, however, did try to intervene on behalf of the Jews,
which is very unusual (and commendable) for a man in his position.
Contrast this with General Petainʼs government at Vichy.
The Germans dug up the cemetery; what did he expect-the Greeks to put
it back? (To turn the tables) Did the Jewish communities in Istanbul,
New York or Toronto protest the Turkish pogrom in Istanbul on September
6, 1955, when 73 churches, 8 cemeteries, 26 schools, 1,004 homes,
4,212 shops and stores, 21 factories, 12 hotels, 97 restaurants,
and 23 warehouses were destroyed?
The article involves Thessaloniki not because "it is an easy target",
as Mr Gedeon purports in an attempt to twist my motives, but because
it is there where out of 46,000 people only 1950 survived! The
Jews at Jannina got it as badly, and for the same reasons as in
Thessaloniki-and it is mentioned in the article. Contrast this with the
Warsaw Ghetto uprising and the prisonersʼ uprising in Auschwitz
(or is it Birkenau?).
This article had no ulterior motives to please or displease anyone,
Greek or Jew. I honestly tried to recreate for the general public
these horrific events, to impart the meaning and the lessons of
the Holocaust.
Mr Gedeon absurdly refuses to accept the fact that those Jews who
survived, survived due to the assistance they received from their
fellow Greek Christians-a very shameful position. Let Mr. Gedeon tell
us: In what other country did the Church and Resistance do more for
the Jews than in Greece?
It is obvious that what displeases Mr. Gedeon is that my article is at
odds with the agenda of an influential segment of the Jewish-American
elites, who have become the mouthpieces of the Turkish Generals in
the Halls of Congress and elsewhere. It is they who shamefully have
been instrumental in the denial of the Pontian and Armenian Genocides,
an insult and a dishonor to the memory of the Jewish victims of the
Holocaust themselves. Mr. Gedeon has appointed himself as the arbiter
of what is politically-correct (according to his agenda), not what
is factually true. His anti-Hellenism is obvious, as it is odious!