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JOSEPH SHAGAL: "BOTH ECONOMIC ASSOCIATIONS AND MILITARY ALLIANCES ARE POSSIBLE WITH SUCH A PARTNER AS AZERBAIJAN"
Today.Az
02 October 2008 [13:09] - Today.Az
Azerbaijan
Day.Az interview with Joseph Shagal, deputy of Israeli Knesset and
chairman of the Israel-Azerbaijan interparliamentary group.
- Mass medias have recently reported that in line with an existing
bilateral agreement, Israel will supply Azerbaijan with ammunitions
for hundreds of millions of shekel. This includes advanced missile
systems, communication means, military facilities and equipment,
produced by concerns "Taasiya tsvait" and "Tadiran". Do you consider
this information reliable or is it a lie, aimed at consumption in
some countries of the region?
- Except for the announcement of the Gaarets newspaper, you are
referring to, I do not have any official confirmation or denial of
this information either from Israeli or Azerbaijani official sources.
- The same Gaarets newspaper states that the contacts between Jerusalem
and Baku have intensified due to the Iranian threat. Do you consider
that such threat is possible against Azerbaijan?
- I can answer positively to the first part of your question: the
political, economic and cultural contacts between Jerusalem and Baku
are really active and fruitful, which is, naturally, encouraging for
the supporters of the Azerbaijani-Israeli cooperation, whose number
is not small in our and, I hope, your country.
As for the second part of the question, it should be put to the
leadership of Azerbaijan, which has its own vision of the strategic
situation in the region.
The fact that you do not ask me whether there is an Iranian threat
for Israel evidences that this question does not raise any doubts
in you. As for Israel, we are confident that the accelerated rates
of the Iranian nuclear program and stubborn ignoring of the demands
of IAEA controllers are a real threat not only for Israel, but also
for the whole civilian world.
- The information about possible supplies of advanced weapon to
Azerbaijan by Israel via Turkey appeared in press several years
ago. The possible creation of the military alliance of these two
countries was also spoken of. Is this idea real?
- It is real. But the question is: how much it corresponds to the
state and national interests of each of the three countries.
I would remind that the idea of creation of such a alliance when needed
is not new. The analysts' proposal of the reality of the strategic
axle Baku -Ankara - Jerusalem first appeared in western press more
than a decade ago, almost, simultaneously with the encapsulation of
the Karabakh conflict and occupation of a large part of Azerbaijan by
Armenians. The idea appeared due to the balanced position of Baku,
which did not allow to launch a large scale war in the Caucasus
region. In other words, Azerbaijan, in the last years of the 20th
century, declared himself to be a serious player, which avoids military
and political adventures and maximally uses all opportunities for
the peaceful resolution of the conflict. To my mind: both economic
associations and military alliances can be created with such a partner
- if there is a need and a direct interest of the Azerbaijani Republic.
- During the recent conflict in Georgia, some representatives of
Moscow, accused Israel of "illegal armament of Georgia". Do you admit
the possibility of such dark sides in the Georgian-Israeli military
cooperation?
- I do not quite understand the phrase "illegal armament of
Georgia". Has the world community imposed embargo on the supplies
of weapons to Georgia, which Israel, by example of the same Iran,
supplying weapons to religions fans of Hizbullah and HAMAS, has
violated?
This is an absolutely legal trade of arms, which, as you know, is one
of the main articles of Iranian export. I would also like to note that
Israeli military supplies to Georgia were absolutely "transparent"
and limited by quite an "easy" complex of ammunitions, including
shooting guns, some kinds of artillery, explosives, missile defense
and communication means, reconnaissance pilotless jets and shells. As
is seen, we did not supply any advanced jets, or tanks or attacking
missile complexes to Georgia (despite persistent requests of Tbilisi).
Moreover, after the first attacks on Tskhinvali, Israeli stopped
its military supplies to Georgia and withdrew all representatives of
the firms, supplying arms to Georgia, from this country, which was
positively assessed even in Moscow. As you see, there are no "dark"
sides in the Georgian-Israeli military cooperation.
- Before the aforementioned events around South Ossetia Moscow was
speaking much of the active use of pilotless jets of Israeli production
by Georgia. On the whole, which military technique and ammunitions,
produced in Israeli, can be the most urgent in the South Caucasus
countries?
- I think you know that Israeli military industry is producing almost
the whole range of advanced highly technological ammunitions. We do
not conceal it from anyone. On the list of the countries- the world
exporters of arms, Israel retains the place among the five leaders,
which is, undoubtedly, the remarkable achievement of the Israeli
economy.
On the other hand - I have partially spoken of it, answering the
previous question - Israel is a democratic country, where export of
arms is under stiff control of the state. Israel will never supply
arms to a country, if this may affect the security of neighbor
states, destabilize the political situation in a definite region
or have a negative impact on the Jewish community of this country,
even theoretically.
Though I'm not a specialist in the sphere of armament and I have no
idea of which Israeli military technique or weapons may become urgent
in the South Caucasus region, I do not doubt that in any case the
issue will be settled not by the countries, which need these arms,
but by Israel, which has these arms...
- Which of the South Caucasus countries is the most perspective
military partner of Israel?
- As a historian, I remember that military cooperation is impossible
without a political one. Israel, due to its unique geopolitical
location, is always ready to expand the circle of its friends, which
envisions the positive attitude of a partner towards Israel and the
Jewish community in this country.
Israel really needs friends, partners and states, with whom it can
build mutually profitable relations on a long-term basis. I hope you
understand that such relations are created on the basis of stable
political, economic, diplomatic, scientific and cultural cooperation
on all levels and only after it, when cooperation grows into stable
friendly relations, the issue of partnership in the sphere of defense
can be raised.
Considering my experience, based on 40 years of living in Baku, I hope
that Azerbaijan has everything for becoming such a partner to Israel.
Today.Az
02 October 2008 [13:09] - Today.Az
Azerbaijan
Day.Az interview with Joseph Shagal, deputy of Israeli Knesset and
chairman of the Israel-Azerbaijan interparliamentary group.
- Mass medias have recently reported that in line with an existing
bilateral agreement, Israel will supply Azerbaijan with ammunitions
for hundreds of millions of shekel. This includes advanced missile
systems, communication means, military facilities and equipment,
produced by concerns "Taasiya tsvait" and "Tadiran". Do you consider
this information reliable or is it a lie, aimed at consumption in
some countries of the region?
- Except for the announcement of the Gaarets newspaper, you are
referring to, I do not have any official confirmation or denial of
this information either from Israeli or Azerbaijani official sources.
- The same Gaarets newspaper states that the contacts between Jerusalem
and Baku have intensified due to the Iranian threat. Do you consider
that such threat is possible against Azerbaijan?
- I can answer positively to the first part of your question: the
political, economic and cultural contacts between Jerusalem and Baku
are really active and fruitful, which is, naturally, encouraging for
the supporters of the Azerbaijani-Israeli cooperation, whose number
is not small in our and, I hope, your country.
As for the second part of the question, it should be put to the
leadership of Azerbaijan, which has its own vision of the strategic
situation in the region.
The fact that you do not ask me whether there is an Iranian threat
for Israel evidences that this question does not raise any doubts
in you. As for Israel, we are confident that the accelerated rates
of the Iranian nuclear program and stubborn ignoring of the demands
of IAEA controllers are a real threat not only for Israel, but also
for the whole civilian world.
- The information about possible supplies of advanced weapon to
Azerbaijan by Israel via Turkey appeared in press several years
ago. The possible creation of the military alliance of these two
countries was also spoken of. Is this idea real?
- It is real. But the question is: how much it corresponds to the
state and national interests of each of the three countries.
I would remind that the idea of creation of such a alliance when needed
is not new. The analysts' proposal of the reality of the strategic
axle Baku -Ankara - Jerusalem first appeared in western press more
than a decade ago, almost, simultaneously with the encapsulation of
the Karabakh conflict and occupation of a large part of Azerbaijan by
Armenians. The idea appeared due to the balanced position of Baku,
which did not allow to launch a large scale war in the Caucasus
region. In other words, Azerbaijan, in the last years of the 20th
century, declared himself to be a serious player, which avoids military
and political adventures and maximally uses all opportunities for
the peaceful resolution of the conflict. To my mind: both economic
associations and military alliances can be created with such a partner
- if there is a need and a direct interest of the Azerbaijani Republic.
- During the recent conflict in Georgia, some representatives of
Moscow, accused Israel of "illegal armament of Georgia". Do you admit
the possibility of such dark sides in the Georgian-Israeli military
cooperation?
- I do not quite understand the phrase "illegal armament of
Georgia". Has the world community imposed embargo on the supplies
of weapons to Georgia, which Israel, by example of the same Iran,
supplying weapons to religions fans of Hizbullah and HAMAS, has
violated?
This is an absolutely legal trade of arms, which, as you know, is one
of the main articles of Iranian export. I would also like to note that
Israeli military supplies to Georgia were absolutely "transparent"
and limited by quite an "easy" complex of ammunitions, including
shooting guns, some kinds of artillery, explosives, missile defense
and communication means, reconnaissance pilotless jets and shells. As
is seen, we did not supply any advanced jets, or tanks or attacking
missile complexes to Georgia (despite persistent requests of Tbilisi).
Moreover, after the first attacks on Tskhinvali, Israeli stopped
its military supplies to Georgia and withdrew all representatives of
the firms, supplying arms to Georgia, from this country, which was
positively assessed even in Moscow. As you see, there are no "dark"
sides in the Georgian-Israeli military cooperation.
- Before the aforementioned events around South Ossetia Moscow was
speaking much of the active use of pilotless jets of Israeli production
by Georgia. On the whole, which military technique and ammunitions,
produced in Israeli, can be the most urgent in the South Caucasus
countries?
- I think you know that Israeli military industry is producing almost
the whole range of advanced highly technological ammunitions. We do
not conceal it from anyone. On the list of the countries- the world
exporters of arms, Israel retains the place among the five leaders,
which is, undoubtedly, the remarkable achievement of the Israeli
economy.
On the other hand - I have partially spoken of it, answering the
previous question - Israel is a democratic country, where export of
arms is under stiff control of the state. Israel will never supply
arms to a country, if this may affect the security of neighbor
states, destabilize the political situation in a definite region
or have a negative impact on the Jewish community of this country,
even theoretically.
Though I'm not a specialist in the sphere of armament and I have no
idea of which Israeli military technique or weapons may become urgent
in the South Caucasus region, I do not doubt that in any case the
issue will be settled not by the countries, which need these arms,
but by Israel, which has these arms...
- Which of the South Caucasus countries is the most perspective
military partner of Israel?
- As a historian, I remember that military cooperation is impossible
without a political one. Israel, due to its unique geopolitical
location, is always ready to expand the circle of its friends, which
envisions the positive attitude of a partner towards Israel and the
Jewish community in this country.
Israel really needs friends, partners and states, with whom it can
build mutually profitable relations on a long-term basis. I hope you
understand that such relations are created on the basis of stable
political, economic, diplomatic, scientific and cultural cooperation
on all levels and only after it, when cooperation grows into stable
friendly relations, the issue of partnership in the sphere of defense
can be raised.
Considering my experience, based on 40 years of living in Baku, I hope
that Azerbaijan has everything for becoming such a partner to Israel.