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CANADIAN WAR JOURNALIST SCOTT TAYLOR: ARMENIA CAN'T MOVE ON FORWARD WITH CLOSED BORDERS
T. Teymur
Today
http://www.today.az/news/politics/61 185.html
Feb 9 2010
Azerbaijan
Exclusive interview with former professional soldier, Canadian
war correspondent, and editor and publisher of the Esprit de Corps
magazine, Scott Taylor.
Scott Taylor has been editor and publisher of Esprit de Corps since
1988. Since the inception of Esprit de Corps, Scott has logged over one
million air miles as a war correspondent reporting from such global
hot spots as the Persian Gulf, Cambodia, Western Sahara, Croatia,
Bosnia, Iraq, Turkey, Yugoslavia, Kosovo, Macedonia, Azerbaijan
and Afghanistan.
Since August 2000, Taylor has made a total of 21 trips into Iraq to
report on the effects of the UN sanctions, the ravages of depleted
uranium following the 1991 Gulf War, and the heightening tensions with
the United States. In March 2003, during his last trip prior to the
United States' intervention, Scott Taylor was asked to leave Iraq for
fear of his being a spy for the Israeli Mossad. Following the swift
U.S. victory, Scott returned frequently to Iraq to view first-hand
the ongoing humanitarian crisis plaguing this still embattled country.
Then, for five harrowing days in September 2004, he experienced the
rare occasion when "getting the story becomes the story." Held captive
by Ansar al-Islam mujahedeen in northern Iraq, his release generated
a wave of international media coverage.
In an exclusive interview, Mr. Taylor speaks about the infamous
Nagorno-Karabakh conflict, Armenia, Azerbaijan, and other issues.
As far as I know, this is not your first visit to Azerbaijan. What was
the main purpose of you writing the book "Unreconciled Differences"?
The main purpose I think, is to readdress what I believe is an
inbound on reporting on the region, mostly on the situation in
Nagorno-Karabakh region, between Azerbaijan and Armenia. In every
conflict situation I've covered in the past, there's always the
other side of the story. Each side has their own story, and truth is
somewhere in between. For us, in the West, most of what we hear about
the incidents and events between Azerbaijan and Armenia, comes from
Armenian side. And looking closely at it, I realized, that there was
a vacuum of information, that it was not the full story. The book
is of course a small void, but I thought, I'd at least make people
realize that this is not the full story of what happened.
Now, from your point of view, how at the present time do you assess
the possibility of a military action between Armenia and Azerbaijan?
Lets put it like this - if you had the last call, would you even
consider this option?
In this particular case, Azerbaijan has the right to claim their
own territory.
As far as I am concerned, just a couple of days ago, you were
hosted by the International Strategic Research Organization (USAK),
and you touched a number of topics during your lecture, including
the Nagorno-Karabakh issue. The opinions of the foreign experts
differ, some say that the conflict problem is directly connected
with the possible opening of the Turkish-Armenian border, some say
the opposite. What is your opinion on this?
Well, I think they are connected. Originally, shutting the borders
happened because of the conflict between Azerbaijan and Armenia,
for Nagorno-Karabakh. And as a result, it became clear, that there
won't be any movements on the border opening, until Armenia leaves
the occupied territories of Azerbaijan. Now that there's a softening,
Azerbaijan has the right to be somewhat fearful that the pressure
on Armenia will become lesser. At the same time, Armenia has got its
own issues, with Turkey.
Both parties have to abandon some of their hardline, I am not sure
that either party can do that, given their domestic political issues.
The fact, that they are trying to move forward, is a good sign,
but as I mention in my book, the past has to be reconsidered, and
it will require far more admission on the Armenian side. In order to
find this historical truth about the events of 1915, both Turkey and
Armenia have to be able to share the information.
During the same lecture, you mentioned the so called Armenian
"genocide", and what you said was "History should be decided by
historians and not by foreign governments".
I mean, if you pull back from the hardliners, the Turks have made far
more headway, because they are being accused of something so extreme.
As you know, Armenians all over the world are claiming that this was
"genocide", and to be honest, being a Canadian, I am ashamed that the
Canadian parliament recognized the "genocide", without knowing all
the needed details. In fact, the Canadians have gone even further
ahead that the Armenians, which are still, in theory, prepared to
make the re-approachment with the protocols, with Turkey. Canadian
government monitors Caucasus from Moscow and Turkey, they don't have
any representation in the Caucasus at all. This is a situation,
where I can just state the obvious - we don't know a thing about
Caucasus. The same can be said about Russia and Georgia, you cant
just state that this player is good, and this one is bad, it is a
lot more difficult than that.
Even with Armenia, and Nagorno-Karabakh, when I interviewed them, the
people in Karabakh are a lot different from people in Yerevan. Most
people from the elite of Yerevan are formally from Nagorno-Karabakh,
and they have their own independent mindsets, but some other, more
pragmatic Armenians from Yerevan do understand, that it's time to
move on forward, and you cant do that with closed borders, and its
impossible to rely forever on the cash donations from diaspora. But,
if you offend the diaspora by making a reapproachment with Turkey
and Azerbaijan, they will simply turn their back on you. And then,
what are you going to replace the incoming money with? In long term,
including pipelines and the normalized neighborly relations it can
turn out well, but until that the country will be in big debts, poverty
and such for the next 20 years. And no one is prepared for that.
While we are on the subject, what can, in your opinion, happen close
to the date of 24th of April, which is considered the "genocide"
date for Armenians? Should any major movements on Armenian-Turkish
relations be expected?
I don't think there has been any movement so far, on the Armenian
side. So far it's too soon to state anything. The protocols were a
step forward, but this is going to be a game of inches, because in
Caucasus, everyone has a gun pointed at someone else's head. Everyone
wants to lower that gun down, but they can't.
Russia is considered one of the major players in the SC region, and
so is Turkey. With all the other problems to deal with (such as AFG,
IRAQ), it seems like US began to lose its power in the South Caucasus
region. Do you believe it is so?
Up until now, the America has been the only real superpower. Until
the Cold War. Now, the US are far too stretched - they have to deal
with Afghanistan, they have to deal with Iraq, and Iran for example
is not even afraid of being attacked by the US, since, they are too
stretched thin to mount any new operation. At this particular time
everyone realized, that America is vulnerable. They can simply keep
printing money, but it doesn't solve all the problems. Again, if your
interests include to get to the Caspian oil, then you better understand
Caucasus. And the more research I do, the less I realize I know.
Caucasus is a real minefield.
In your opinion, can we think of some kind of pressure coming from
the West towards Turkey, in order to open the borders with Armenia?
It is possible. How Armenia is able to hold on to good relations
with America, when they are friends with Iran, and Russia? Normally,
when you are friends with either Russia or Iran, to US you are on
a blacklist. Armenia is friends with all of them, because of the
diaspora in the US. By itself, Armenia is basically resourceless,
and here you have Azerbaijan, which is oil rich, and has his ways
with the pipelines through Georgia, etc. How does Armenia manage
to keep this in the balance, it's all diaspora's work. So, yes,
I believe there might be some pressure coming from the US towards
Turkey on the opening of the borders matter.
How do you assess the current negotiation process on the Karabakh
conflict between Armenian and Azerbaijani presidents?
There's always talks. There is no movement. If something happens
quickly - It will come with violence. But, let's put it like this -
as long as there are talks, at least people aren't dying. It is in
Armenia's interest to delay the negotiation process, because the
longer they do that, the longer they keep the occupied territories
empty. And I've seen them - they destroyed all, for them it's better
to keep it this way, so the people of Azerbaijan, will not come back,
and try to rebuild everything from scratch. Armenians are trying to
populate the region, which the Azeris should be concerned about. Right
now, the time is on the side of Armenians.
T. Teymur
Today
http://www.today.az/news/politics/61 185.html
Feb 9 2010
Azerbaijan
Exclusive interview with former professional soldier, Canadian
war correspondent, and editor and publisher of the Esprit de Corps
magazine, Scott Taylor.
Scott Taylor has been editor and publisher of Esprit de Corps since
1988. Since the inception of Esprit de Corps, Scott has logged over one
million air miles as a war correspondent reporting from such global
hot spots as the Persian Gulf, Cambodia, Western Sahara, Croatia,
Bosnia, Iraq, Turkey, Yugoslavia, Kosovo, Macedonia, Azerbaijan
and Afghanistan.
Since August 2000, Taylor has made a total of 21 trips into Iraq to
report on the effects of the UN sanctions, the ravages of depleted
uranium following the 1991 Gulf War, and the heightening tensions with
the United States. In March 2003, during his last trip prior to the
United States' intervention, Scott Taylor was asked to leave Iraq for
fear of his being a spy for the Israeli Mossad. Following the swift
U.S. victory, Scott returned frequently to Iraq to view first-hand
the ongoing humanitarian crisis plaguing this still embattled country.
Then, for five harrowing days in September 2004, he experienced the
rare occasion when "getting the story becomes the story." Held captive
by Ansar al-Islam mujahedeen in northern Iraq, his release generated
a wave of international media coverage.
In an exclusive interview, Mr. Taylor speaks about the infamous
Nagorno-Karabakh conflict, Armenia, Azerbaijan, and other issues.
As far as I know, this is not your first visit to Azerbaijan. What was
the main purpose of you writing the book "Unreconciled Differences"?
The main purpose I think, is to readdress what I believe is an
inbound on reporting on the region, mostly on the situation in
Nagorno-Karabakh region, between Azerbaijan and Armenia. In every
conflict situation I've covered in the past, there's always the
other side of the story. Each side has their own story, and truth is
somewhere in between. For us, in the West, most of what we hear about
the incidents and events between Azerbaijan and Armenia, comes from
Armenian side. And looking closely at it, I realized, that there was
a vacuum of information, that it was not the full story. The book
is of course a small void, but I thought, I'd at least make people
realize that this is not the full story of what happened.
Now, from your point of view, how at the present time do you assess
the possibility of a military action between Armenia and Azerbaijan?
Lets put it like this - if you had the last call, would you even
consider this option?
In this particular case, Azerbaijan has the right to claim their
own territory.
As far as I am concerned, just a couple of days ago, you were
hosted by the International Strategic Research Organization (USAK),
and you touched a number of topics during your lecture, including
the Nagorno-Karabakh issue. The opinions of the foreign experts
differ, some say that the conflict problem is directly connected
with the possible opening of the Turkish-Armenian border, some say
the opposite. What is your opinion on this?
Well, I think they are connected. Originally, shutting the borders
happened because of the conflict between Azerbaijan and Armenia,
for Nagorno-Karabakh. And as a result, it became clear, that there
won't be any movements on the border opening, until Armenia leaves
the occupied territories of Azerbaijan. Now that there's a softening,
Azerbaijan has the right to be somewhat fearful that the pressure
on Armenia will become lesser. At the same time, Armenia has got its
own issues, with Turkey.
Both parties have to abandon some of their hardline, I am not sure
that either party can do that, given their domestic political issues.
The fact, that they are trying to move forward, is a good sign,
but as I mention in my book, the past has to be reconsidered, and
it will require far more admission on the Armenian side. In order to
find this historical truth about the events of 1915, both Turkey and
Armenia have to be able to share the information.
During the same lecture, you mentioned the so called Armenian
"genocide", and what you said was "History should be decided by
historians and not by foreign governments".
I mean, if you pull back from the hardliners, the Turks have made far
more headway, because they are being accused of something so extreme.
As you know, Armenians all over the world are claiming that this was
"genocide", and to be honest, being a Canadian, I am ashamed that the
Canadian parliament recognized the "genocide", without knowing all
the needed details. In fact, the Canadians have gone even further
ahead that the Armenians, which are still, in theory, prepared to
make the re-approachment with the protocols, with Turkey. Canadian
government monitors Caucasus from Moscow and Turkey, they don't have
any representation in the Caucasus at all. This is a situation,
where I can just state the obvious - we don't know a thing about
Caucasus. The same can be said about Russia and Georgia, you cant
just state that this player is good, and this one is bad, it is a
lot more difficult than that.
Even with Armenia, and Nagorno-Karabakh, when I interviewed them, the
people in Karabakh are a lot different from people in Yerevan. Most
people from the elite of Yerevan are formally from Nagorno-Karabakh,
and they have their own independent mindsets, but some other, more
pragmatic Armenians from Yerevan do understand, that it's time to
move on forward, and you cant do that with closed borders, and its
impossible to rely forever on the cash donations from diaspora. But,
if you offend the diaspora by making a reapproachment with Turkey
and Azerbaijan, they will simply turn their back on you. And then,
what are you going to replace the incoming money with? In long term,
including pipelines and the normalized neighborly relations it can
turn out well, but until that the country will be in big debts, poverty
and such for the next 20 years. And no one is prepared for that.
While we are on the subject, what can, in your opinion, happen close
to the date of 24th of April, which is considered the "genocide"
date for Armenians? Should any major movements on Armenian-Turkish
relations be expected?
I don't think there has been any movement so far, on the Armenian
side. So far it's too soon to state anything. The protocols were a
step forward, but this is going to be a game of inches, because in
Caucasus, everyone has a gun pointed at someone else's head. Everyone
wants to lower that gun down, but they can't.
Russia is considered one of the major players in the SC region, and
so is Turkey. With all the other problems to deal with (such as AFG,
IRAQ), it seems like US began to lose its power in the South Caucasus
region. Do you believe it is so?
Up until now, the America has been the only real superpower. Until
the Cold War. Now, the US are far too stretched - they have to deal
with Afghanistan, they have to deal with Iraq, and Iran for example
is not even afraid of being attacked by the US, since, they are too
stretched thin to mount any new operation. At this particular time
everyone realized, that America is vulnerable. They can simply keep
printing money, but it doesn't solve all the problems. Again, if your
interests include to get to the Caspian oil, then you better understand
Caucasus. And the more research I do, the less I realize I know.
Caucasus is a real minefield.
In your opinion, can we think of some kind of pressure coming from
the West towards Turkey, in order to open the borders with Armenia?
It is possible. How Armenia is able to hold on to good relations
with America, when they are friends with Iran, and Russia? Normally,
when you are friends with either Russia or Iran, to US you are on
a blacklist. Armenia is friends with all of them, because of the
diaspora in the US. By itself, Armenia is basically resourceless,
and here you have Azerbaijan, which is oil rich, and has his ways
with the pipelines through Georgia, etc. How does Armenia manage
to keep this in the balance, it's all diaspora's work. So, yes,
I believe there might be some pressure coming from the US towards
Turkey on the opening of the borders matter.
How do you assess the current negotiation process on the Karabakh
conflict between Armenian and Azerbaijani presidents?
There's always talks. There is no movement. If something happens
quickly - It will come with violence. But, let's put it like this -
as long as there are talks, at least people aren't dying. It is in
Armenia's interest to delay the negotiation process, because the
longer they do that, the longer they keep the occupied territories
empty. And I've seen them - they destroyed all, for them it's better
to keep it this way, so the people of Azerbaijan, will not come back,
and try to rebuild everything from scratch. Armenians are trying to
populate the region, which the Azeris should be concerned about. Right
now, the time is on the side of Armenians.