Tweet
PROSPECTS OF NKR'S RECOGNITION AS AN INDEPENDENT STATE WERE DESTROYED BY ROBERT KOCHARYAN AND SERZH SARGSYAN
David Stepanyan
ArmInfo
2010-10-05 16:53:00
Interview with Coordinator of Armenian National Congress Levon Zurabyan
What measures the ANC is going to take in its political struggle
against the regime before the parliamentary elections 2012?
We are not at all striving to the blind and severe revolt in Armenia.
We do not want it. The whole strategy of Armenian National Congress is
directed to turn the democratic movement in Armenia into the willful
movement of the people and citizens which remember their rights and
require respecting them.
Unfortunately, today these elementary rights of our citizens are broken
everywhere. But this does not at all mean that we should or are going
to call the people to revolt. Today ANC is acting and is going to act
only by means of the constitutional democratic methods. History shows
that a blind and severe revolt or terror has never led to the goal. It
only led to the bad results. Naturally, we do not want it, and we are
not going to create ruins via breaking the grounds of the regime which
the Armenian society does not like, as later we shall be forced to
struggle against the consequences of these ruins for dozens of years.
Armenia faces many external challenges, including the challenges
of its own security. This is why taking into account the fact that
Armenia faces many external challenges, including the challenge of
its own security, the Armenian National Congress is not going to
organize open confrontation in Armenia. Under the current conditions
of constantly progressing threat of military aggression by Azerbaijan,
as well as permanent threats connected with the blockade of Armenia,
we should act and we act carefully without any desire to damage the
country's interests.
This makes the opposition to be very careful, but this doesn't mean at
all that it will fail to be resolute in its actions when the relevant
moment comes. We should do our best to mobilize people to protect
their own rights by means of legal methods being in the arsenal of any
democratic state: rallies, processions, demonstrations. That is to
say, we shall consistently involve the society in the fight against
the criminal, oligarchic, kleptocratic regime, however, we'll do it
within the frames of the Constitution.
During the last rally the ANC leader Levon Ter-Petrossyan expressed
conviction that Serzh Sargsyan would not finish his term as president.
Is this possible considering that the next presidential election is
scheduled for 2013 and keeping in mind your assurances that you will
use only constitutional methods?
This is quite possible by means of the methods used by Polish,
Czech and even Pakistani people. During the change of power in these
countries they used no axes, swords or guns. The opposition just
managed to mobilize the society in the fight for their rights, and
people stood up for protection of their legitimate right to create
legitimate power in the country. I mean the technology of "velvet"
revolutions, which repeatedly demonstrated its efficiency in many
countries.
This technology is really effective but only in the countries having
relevant conditions. Do we have any prerequisites for this?
First of all, these are domestic premises, as the society is completely
on our side. The society hates the ruling dictatorship in Armenia,
which deprives it of freedom, property and the opportunity to
freely develop and conduct business. As regards external factors,
today the Armenian authorities failed practically in all directions
of foreign policy. The matter concerns the "football diplomacy", and
the great many problems related to the Karabakh conflict settlement,
particularly, anti-Armenian resolutions adopted within international
organizations and growing pressure on Karabakh, as well as ignoring
Karabakh as a party to the conflict.
It is already obvious today that Azerbaijan is gradually increasing
its diplomatic and military-political prevalence amid total inactivity
of the Armenian Foreign Ministry. The situation in the social-economic
sphere has no prospects. Outflow of the population has again reached
large scales, even by official data. The authorities failed everything
they could.
Such scenario is quite logical in Armenia because it is impossible
for one to govern the public that did not elect him. The incumbent
authorities were elected by a group of oligarchs, importer-
monopolists, who needed them to subdue the power levers to make
themselves rich.
Thus, all these failures in the foreign and domestic policy of Armenia
are not just the result of the wrong approach by the authorities
or their low intellectual level. It is first of all the result of
illegitimate regime, the creation of the plutocratic oligarchy that
cares for itself and neglects public interests.
Armenian Foreign Ministry has presented the withdrawal of Azerbaijan's
resolution from the UN General Assembly as a victory. Don't you
think that by putting off the discussion for the next session Baku
has attained its execution?
That is quite natural, as an international mission to inspect the so
called "occupied territories" is going to visit Nagornyy Karabakh.
This is what Azerbaijan wanted to reach in its resolution. And the
draft resolution was recalled just for this purpose. Moreover, it
was for the first time during the whole negotiating process that an
official document has appeared in the form of the recent statement by
the OSCE MF co-chairs, in which the placename Khankendi was mentioned.
Although earlier the Armenian party gained the situation when only
the pre-conflict names of towns were mentioned in all the documents.
It is impossible not to recall about the statement by Bernard Fassier,
which said when crossing the line of contact between the Armenian and
Azerbaijani armed forces that the co-chairs do not cross the border
but stay in one state.
As for the last resolution, Azerbaijan has already passed the
resolution it needed in UN on 14 March 2004, in which Baku practically
gained all its goals. In general, these resolutions are not so much
important for Baku. It is more important for it to implement threats
and impose pressure upon Armenia, the NKR and intermediary by means
of these resolutions.
It is simply necessary because the Azerbaijani points of view
is gradually prevailing the Armenian one behind the sciences of
international diplomacy. Therefore, the ANC has presented a draft
resolution to the public, which the Foreign Ministry of Armenia
should have been submitted to the UN. The draft resolution is a
document prepared by professionals unlike the criticism far from being
professional saying that the ANC did not set forth more radical goals.
However, our initiative received just few quite irresponsible
responses by the Foreign Ministry and a number of political forces
in Armenia. These responses contain absolutely demagogic viewpoint,
specifically, they say that discussion of the Karabakh problem at the
UN will lead the process beyond the Minsk Group, which is extremely
unfavorable to the Armenian party. In the meantime, this process has
already exceeded the framework of the Minsk Group and we have nothing
to do but response to it. As for Azerbaijan, it delicately uses its
levers and influences the process within the frames of the OSCE MG
through discussions at the UN. All this is taking place amid total
inactivity of the Armenian party.
What is Azerbaijan after by insisting on the field mission in
Nagorno-Karabakh?
Azerbaijan wants the international community to express its opinion
on what is going on in "occupied territories" and to state that this
situation is the result of "Armenia's destructive aggression against
Azerbaijan." These are the consequences of the biggest mistake of our
present regime, to be more precise, Robert Kocharyan, who allowed a
change in the very concept of the conflict.
The concept used before 1998 said that the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict
was a conflict between Nagorno-Karabakh and Azerbaijan, who was unable
to give the Nagorno-Karabakh people liberty, protection of human
rights and elementary security. The very essence of the conflict was
the Nagorno-Karabakh people's struggle for these values.
The armed conflict started only after Azerbaijan's aggressive
response. For many years this concept protected Armenia from the
world community's charges of aggression but now that the Armenian
authorities have discarded it this has become impossible.
This happened after Armenian presidents with Karabakh origin swallowed
the bait of the international community and refused the successful
concept, according to which the conflict was not between Armenia and
Azerbaijan, but between Azerbaijan and Nagorno-Karabakh. For its part,
it would be much easier for the international community to negotiate
only with Armenia's leadership, consequently, they shut their eyes
to all the crimes and illegal actions committed by the two Armenian
presidents for the single purpose: to consolidate their personal
power in Armenia. This allowed constructing the negotiation process,
in which the Armenian party represented Armenia and Nagorno-Karabakh
simultaneously due to the Karabakh origin of the two presidents.
This strengthened the domestic political positions of both Robert
Kocharyan and Serzh Sargsyan, but destroyed the conflict concept
making the position of Karabakh and Armenia practically invulnerable.
"Now that the talks are going on between Armenia and Azerbaijan
with the full consent of Kocharyan ans Sargsyan, and Karabakh as a
political formation is not noticed, a quite grounded question arises
in the international community - what for does Armenia occupy the
territories of Azerbaijan? Thus, we state quite openly that the
prospects of recognition of Nagorno-Karabakh as an independent
political state formation were destroyed by Robert Kocharyan and
Serzh Sargsyan. And this was done to consolidate their suspicious
legitimacy and in the prejudice of positions of the Armenian parties
to the Karabakh peace process.
From: A. Papazian
David Stepanyan
ArmInfo
2010-10-05 16:53:00
Interview with Coordinator of Armenian National Congress Levon Zurabyan
What measures the ANC is going to take in its political struggle
against the regime before the parliamentary elections 2012?
We are not at all striving to the blind and severe revolt in Armenia.
We do not want it. The whole strategy of Armenian National Congress is
directed to turn the democratic movement in Armenia into the willful
movement of the people and citizens which remember their rights and
require respecting them.
Unfortunately, today these elementary rights of our citizens are broken
everywhere. But this does not at all mean that we should or are going
to call the people to revolt. Today ANC is acting and is going to act
only by means of the constitutional democratic methods. History shows
that a blind and severe revolt or terror has never led to the goal. It
only led to the bad results. Naturally, we do not want it, and we are
not going to create ruins via breaking the grounds of the regime which
the Armenian society does not like, as later we shall be forced to
struggle against the consequences of these ruins for dozens of years.
Armenia faces many external challenges, including the challenges
of its own security. This is why taking into account the fact that
Armenia faces many external challenges, including the challenge of
its own security, the Armenian National Congress is not going to
organize open confrontation in Armenia. Under the current conditions
of constantly progressing threat of military aggression by Azerbaijan,
as well as permanent threats connected with the blockade of Armenia,
we should act and we act carefully without any desire to damage the
country's interests.
This makes the opposition to be very careful, but this doesn't mean at
all that it will fail to be resolute in its actions when the relevant
moment comes. We should do our best to mobilize people to protect
their own rights by means of legal methods being in the arsenal of any
democratic state: rallies, processions, demonstrations. That is to
say, we shall consistently involve the society in the fight against
the criminal, oligarchic, kleptocratic regime, however, we'll do it
within the frames of the Constitution.
During the last rally the ANC leader Levon Ter-Petrossyan expressed
conviction that Serzh Sargsyan would not finish his term as president.
Is this possible considering that the next presidential election is
scheduled for 2013 and keeping in mind your assurances that you will
use only constitutional methods?
This is quite possible by means of the methods used by Polish,
Czech and even Pakistani people. During the change of power in these
countries they used no axes, swords or guns. The opposition just
managed to mobilize the society in the fight for their rights, and
people stood up for protection of their legitimate right to create
legitimate power in the country. I mean the technology of "velvet"
revolutions, which repeatedly demonstrated its efficiency in many
countries.
This technology is really effective but only in the countries having
relevant conditions. Do we have any prerequisites for this?
First of all, these are domestic premises, as the society is completely
on our side. The society hates the ruling dictatorship in Armenia,
which deprives it of freedom, property and the opportunity to
freely develop and conduct business. As regards external factors,
today the Armenian authorities failed practically in all directions
of foreign policy. The matter concerns the "football diplomacy", and
the great many problems related to the Karabakh conflict settlement,
particularly, anti-Armenian resolutions adopted within international
organizations and growing pressure on Karabakh, as well as ignoring
Karabakh as a party to the conflict.
It is already obvious today that Azerbaijan is gradually increasing
its diplomatic and military-political prevalence amid total inactivity
of the Armenian Foreign Ministry. The situation in the social-economic
sphere has no prospects. Outflow of the population has again reached
large scales, even by official data. The authorities failed everything
they could.
Such scenario is quite logical in Armenia because it is impossible
for one to govern the public that did not elect him. The incumbent
authorities were elected by a group of oligarchs, importer-
monopolists, who needed them to subdue the power levers to make
themselves rich.
Thus, all these failures in the foreign and domestic policy of Armenia
are not just the result of the wrong approach by the authorities
or their low intellectual level. It is first of all the result of
illegitimate regime, the creation of the plutocratic oligarchy that
cares for itself and neglects public interests.
Armenian Foreign Ministry has presented the withdrawal of Azerbaijan's
resolution from the UN General Assembly as a victory. Don't you
think that by putting off the discussion for the next session Baku
has attained its execution?
That is quite natural, as an international mission to inspect the so
called "occupied territories" is going to visit Nagornyy Karabakh.
This is what Azerbaijan wanted to reach in its resolution. And the
draft resolution was recalled just for this purpose. Moreover, it
was for the first time during the whole negotiating process that an
official document has appeared in the form of the recent statement by
the OSCE MF co-chairs, in which the placename Khankendi was mentioned.
Although earlier the Armenian party gained the situation when only
the pre-conflict names of towns were mentioned in all the documents.
It is impossible not to recall about the statement by Bernard Fassier,
which said when crossing the line of contact between the Armenian and
Azerbaijani armed forces that the co-chairs do not cross the border
but stay in one state.
As for the last resolution, Azerbaijan has already passed the
resolution it needed in UN on 14 March 2004, in which Baku practically
gained all its goals. In general, these resolutions are not so much
important for Baku. It is more important for it to implement threats
and impose pressure upon Armenia, the NKR and intermediary by means
of these resolutions.
It is simply necessary because the Azerbaijani points of view
is gradually prevailing the Armenian one behind the sciences of
international diplomacy. Therefore, the ANC has presented a draft
resolution to the public, which the Foreign Ministry of Armenia
should have been submitted to the UN. The draft resolution is a
document prepared by professionals unlike the criticism far from being
professional saying that the ANC did not set forth more radical goals.
However, our initiative received just few quite irresponsible
responses by the Foreign Ministry and a number of political forces
in Armenia. These responses contain absolutely demagogic viewpoint,
specifically, they say that discussion of the Karabakh problem at the
UN will lead the process beyond the Minsk Group, which is extremely
unfavorable to the Armenian party. In the meantime, this process has
already exceeded the framework of the Minsk Group and we have nothing
to do but response to it. As for Azerbaijan, it delicately uses its
levers and influences the process within the frames of the OSCE MG
through discussions at the UN. All this is taking place amid total
inactivity of the Armenian party.
What is Azerbaijan after by insisting on the field mission in
Nagorno-Karabakh?
Azerbaijan wants the international community to express its opinion
on what is going on in "occupied territories" and to state that this
situation is the result of "Armenia's destructive aggression against
Azerbaijan." These are the consequences of the biggest mistake of our
present regime, to be more precise, Robert Kocharyan, who allowed a
change in the very concept of the conflict.
The concept used before 1998 said that the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict
was a conflict between Nagorno-Karabakh and Azerbaijan, who was unable
to give the Nagorno-Karabakh people liberty, protection of human
rights and elementary security. The very essence of the conflict was
the Nagorno-Karabakh people's struggle for these values.
The armed conflict started only after Azerbaijan's aggressive
response. For many years this concept protected Armenia from the
world community's charges of aggression but now that the Armenian
authorities have discarded it this has become impossible.
This happened after Armenian presidents with Karabakh origin swallowed
the bait of the international community and refused the successful
concept, according to which the conflict was not between Armenia and
Azerbaijan, but between Azerbaijan and Nagorno-Karabakh. For its part,
it would be much easier for the international community to negotiate
only with Armenia's leadership, consequently, they shut their eyes
to all the crimes and illegal actions committed by the two Armenian
presidents for the single purpose: to consolidate their personal
power in Armenia. This allowed constructing the negotiation process,
in which the Armenian party represented Armenia and Nagorno-Karabakh
simultaneously due to the Karabakh origin of the two presidents.
This strengthened the domestic political positions of both Robert
Kocharyan and Serzh Sargsyan, but destroyed the conflict concept
making the position of Karabakh and Armenia practically invulnerable.
"Now that the talks are going on between Armenia and Azerbaijan
with the full consent of Kocharyan ans Sargsyan, and Karabakh as a
political formation is not noticed, a quite grounded question arises
in the international community - what for does Armenia occupy the
territories of Azerbaijan? Thus, we state quite openly that the
prospects of recognition of Nagorno-Karabakh as an independent
political state formation were destroyed by Robert Kocharyan and
Serzh Sargsyan. And this was done to consolidate their suspicious
legitimacy and in the prejudice of positions of the Armenian parties
to the Karabakh peace process.
From: A. Papazian