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GEORGIA FACING THREAT OF MUSLIM DENOMINATIONS CONFRONTING EACH OTHER
Alia, Georgia
May 31 2013
Mamuka Areshidze: 'It is a really serious danger for the country'
A great part of society does not know that a mosque is being built
in Ponichala [outskirts of capital Tbilisi]. The issue has not been
made public up to now. What threats does the construction of a mosque
pose and what danger can it cause for Georgia?
Expert in Caucasus issues Mamuka Areshidze substantiated the issue
in his interview to Alia.
[Samkharadze] Up to now, the construction of a mosque in Ponichala
has raised no stir. Why was the issue secretly pushed and why was
the vigilance dulled?
Wahhabism picking up "momentum" in Georgia
[Areshidze] The thing is that all this has a prehistory and I would
like to ask you to publish everything I say. Back in the early 1990s,
the then Russian leadership opened the gate for Islamist groupings
to hinder the national movement. In 1995, a person who is the leader
of Al-Qa'ida today, arrived in [Russia's North Caucasus Republic of]
Dagestan. His name is [Abu-Mus'ab] al-Zarqawi. He is an Arab. And
this is when the term Wahhabi first emerged. They opened the gate to
organizations preaching radical Islam, which was used as a political
instrument. It must be noted that in 1995, an Arab mullah first
appeared in [predominantly ethnic Chechen-populated] Pankisi Gorge in
Georgia. At the time, the fact was given insufficient attention by the
Georgian special services. Wahhabism was a novelty not showing any
special aggression in Georgia. However, as soon as Chechen refugees
appeared in the Pankisi Gorge, Wahhabism spread more widely. Things
came to such a pitch that at they made an attempt to oust mullahs
from a traditional Islamist mosque. Having failed to do so, they
constructed a new mosque. Correspondingly, there are two mosques in
Pankisi today. To be able to control the situation in the Pankisi
Gorge, they decided to rely on Wahhabis.
Azerbaijani, Iranian influences struggling in Georgia's Azeri-populated
area
The Georgian authorities relied on force rather than professionals.
They used blackmail and all sorts of nasty methods. This ideology was
implemented in the [Pankisi] Gorge by brothers Lortkipanidze. Later,
one of the brothers became [former Georgian Interior Minister]
Vano Merabishvili's deputy and the other became head of the
security [department] in Kakheti [of which Pankisi is part]. Then,
the [religious] denomination started to spread in Kvemo Kartli
[predominantly populated by ethnic Azeris], where the situation is as
follows: There, Azerbaijani and Iranian influences are struggling with
each other at the state level. Once, there was also Turkish influence,
which is now reduced despite the fact that in Kvemo Kartli, there are
representatives of the Turkish denomination too. I mean the Sunnis. It
should be noted that Kvemo Kartli is predominantly [populated by]
followers of the Muslim denomination, which is dominant in Iran.
However, the Azerbaijanis are a Turkic tribe. The situation is
paradoxical. By the rules, they should be pro-Turkish. However,
with regard to religion, they are inclined to Iran. As a result, in
Kvemo Kartli, Shi'a Azerbaijan and Shi'a Iran are struggling with
each other. Their struggle for the influence in Kvemo Kartli is a
very complicated issue, as the situation is extremely difficult. The
Iranians seem to be trying to influence the situation there by means
of Azerbaijanis living in Georgia. In addition to it all, Wahhabism
is picking up momentum in Pankisi.
Now let us discuss what happened in the outskirts of Tbilisi. The
place is mainly populated by Shi'a Azerbaijanis. Out of a sudden,
a community is formed there calling itself "Islamic community". They
appealed to the City Hall for a permission to build a prayer house.
Eventually, they received the permission. The fact caused indignation
among the local Shi'a population, which is natural, as Wahhabism is
absolutely unacceptable to them. When I saw the document, which was
published by your newspaper, too, I read a very interesting piece of
information there. The City Hall gave a building permit to a corporate
entity. This means that it cannot be a private house as the City Hall
is trying to say in self-defence that they gave a permit to build a
private house. This is a building given to a corporate entity. In
reality, they are building a mosque. The main thing is that the
City Hall did it intentionally aiming to bring more tensions to the
situation, or they gave permission out of ignorance. If you know
nothing, why do you give permission? After all, it was possible to
ask others... [Ellipsis as published] The head of the organization is
Mufti Kamil Mamedov. Shi'ism knows no term like this. He is a shaykh.
Situations like this should be approached with caution. This is not
a certain harmless sect, whose existence causes no problems. This
is a Wahhabi organization. Wahhabism has taken on in Kvemo Kartli
in a creeping format. I have always said that the Pankisi Gorge was
a stepping stone and it would by all means go on. We can see the
results brought about by Wahhabism in the North Caucasus. The first
thing Wahhabis did was to start a struggle against the followers of
local Islam. Immediately after beating them, they went on to struggle
against secular forces. Therefore, it all constitutes a really serious
danger for the country. Incidentally, our Western partners disapprove
of the fact that we pay no attention to all this.
[Samkharadze] Yes, but Wahhabism in Kvemo Kartli and the whole of
Georgia is controlled by the security service, is it not?
[Areshidze] Control is not enough. You should be well aware of the
different denominations existing in Islam and you should not only
control, but should know who is backed by whom, so as to be able
to settle the situation. Just control is not enough in a situation
like this.
Neighbouring countries struggling for influence in Georgia
[Samkharadze] The following headline appeared in the Azerbaijani
media: "Iran is going to hit Azerbaijan from Borchalo [old name of the
Azeri-populated area in Georgia adjacent to Azerbaijan". It drew a huge
response outside this country. According to the article, the Ahlul-Bayt
[descendants of Prophet Muhammad] organization in Georgia is busy
popularizing Iran. Finances were allocated for the 2012 parliamentary
election in support of several [ethnic] Azeris to become MPs. One of
them succeeded in becoming an MP via the Georgian Dream party. Money
was transferred for popularizing Iran and thousands of young people
from Borchalo were sent to Iran to study. In Tbilisi, Ahlul-Bayt
built an office on the money received from Iran. What is going on,
Batono [Georgian polite form of addressing man] Mamuka? What office
is it and what are its functions? We know that the United States
is getting ready to hit Iran. Meanwhile, Iranian organizations are
founded in Tbilisi and carrying out their work.
[Areshidze] Moscow is interested in replacing [Azeri President Ilham]
Aliyev's regime. For this reason, a club of billionaires was founded
in Moscow, its members being Moscow-based [ethnic] Azeri billionaires.
This club [Ahlul-Bayt] was founded with their help. The club is also
known as Azerross [Azerbaijan and Russia]. Their aim is to struggle
for influence. Can you see what is going on in Kvemo Kartli? Shi'as,
Sunnis, Wahhabis, plus the billionaires' club are all struggling for
influence. In fact, this is a running process. I do not know how well
the security service is controlling it. It looked as if the processes
were under control in previous years. However, it is a fact that these
groupings have consolidated and enlarged. The office of Ahlul-Bayt is
located in Tbilisi, at 14, Zhani Kalandadze St. It is a humanitarian
organization, to be more precise, an Islamic educational organization.
It would be a lie to say that the organization was spotted to be
carrying out activities against the state. I would also like to add
that the Iranians are being very delicate towards Georgia. But as
regards the [ethnic] Azeris living in Georgia, they are doing their
best to use these people for the interest of their own influence.
[Ethnic] Azeris living in Georgia are not distinguished by their
religious devoutness. If the processes were deep, I would not be
giving you an interview. Instead, I would be shouting in respective
[government] offices. I am giving you this interview since I know
that things can be remedied at the public level.
Despite the fact that Iran is indeed being delicate towards Georgia,
all countries are making efforts to gain influence in this country.
These are Russia, the United States, Turkey, Iran and even our
neighbour Armenia. Everyone is struggling for influence; some have
interests in Georgia. We are the only imbeciles. We even fail to
organize our disaporas in Russia, Turkey or the North Caucasus,
not to mention other countries.
Muslim prayer house likely to be turned into storehouse of weapons
[Samkharadze] Yet, a mosque it being built in Ponichala. Can you tell
us what particular threats might it pose.
[Areshidze] The mosque has not been completed yet: Only the walls
and the dome have been built. I would like to say that I am not and
will never be against constructing mosques. It is not this particular
mosque that constitutes a danger, but a likely confrontation between
local Shi'as and Wahhabis to take place on our territory in case
Wahhabis turn this prayer house of Islam into their outpost. Today,
it is going to be an educational centre. Tomorrow, it will become a
place for political debates. The day after tomorrow, it will be used
to store weapons. Chechnya and Dagestan have already gone through it.
On the whole, I would like to say that if Islam exists in Georgia, it
means that it is part of the Georgian religious culture. And if so,
[our] young people should not be going abroad to study, but should
be capable of receiving education in Georgia. Similarly to Christian
youths getting education in ecclesiastic schools, Muslim youths should
be studying in madrasahs built in Georgia. To sum up, I would like to
urge the Georgian authorities to pay due attention to the issue. In
addition, the Muslim administration of Georgia should undergo a serious
reorganization. This is what our Muslim population insists, on so that
people like Vagip Akperov, who is a nonentity and enjoys no authority,
does not become chief shaykh. He was attached to the security [service]
of the former government, and now resides in the Tbilisi mosque and
does not allow anyone to enter it. This is why other centres emerge
in Azeri villages, uncontrollable centres and religious houses.
[Translated from Georgian]
Alia, Georgia
May 31 2013
Mamuka Areshidze: 'It is a really serious danger for the country'
A great part of society does not know that a mosque is being built
in Ponichala [outskirts of capital Tbilisi]. The issue has not been
made public up to now. What threats does the construction of a mosque
pose and what danger can it cause for Georgia?
Expert in Caucasus issues Mamuka Areshidze substantiated the issue
in his interview to Alia.
[Samkharadze] Up to now, the construction of a mosque in Ponichala
has raised no stir. Why was the issue secretly pushed and why was
the vigilance dulled?
Wahhabism picking up "momentum" in Georgia
[Areshidze] The thing is that all this has a prehistory and I would
like to ask you to publish everything I say. Back in the early 1990s,
the then Russian leadership opened the gate for Islamist groupings
to hinder the national movement. In 1995, a person who is the leader
of Al-Qa'ida today, arrived in [Russia's North Caucasus Republic of]
Dagestan. His name is [Abu-Mus'ab] al-Zarqawi. He is an Arab. And
this is when the term Wahhabi first emerged. They opened the gate to
organizations preaching radical Islam, which was used as a political
instrument. It must be noted that in 1995, an Arab mullah first
appeared in [predominantly ethnic Chechen-populated] Pankisi Gorge in
Georgia. At the time, the fact was given insufficient attention by the
Georgian special services. Wahhabism was a novelty not showing any
special aggression in Georgia. However, as soon as Chechen refugees
appeared in the Pankisi Gorge, Wahhabism spread more widely. Things
came to such a pitch that at they made an attempt to oust mullahs
from a traditional Islamist mosque. Having failed to do so, they
constructed a new mosque. Correspondingly, there are two mosques in
Pankisi today. To be able to control the situation in the Pankisi
Gorge, they decided to rely on Wahhabis.
Azerbaijani, Iranian influences struggling in Georgia's Azeri-populated
area
The Georgian authorities relied on force rather than professionals.
They used blackmail and all sorts of nasty methods. This ideology was
implemented in the [Pankisi] Gorge by brothers Lortkipanidze. Later,
one of the brothers became [former Georgian Interior Minister]
Vano Merabishvili's deputy and the other became head of the
security [department] in Kakheti [of which Pankisi is part]. Then,
the [religious] denomination started to spread in Kvemo Kartli
[predominantly populated by ethnic Azeris], where the situation is as
follows: There, Azerbaijani and Iranian influences are struggling with
each other at the state level. Once, there was also Turkish influence,
which is now reduced despite the fact that in Kvemo Kartli, there are
representatives of the Turkish denomination too. I mean the Sunnis. It
should be noted that Kvemo Kartli is predominantly [populated by]
followers of the Muslim denomination, which is dominant in Iran.
However, the Azerbaijanis are a Turkic tribe. The situation is
paradoxical. By the rules, they should be pro-Turkish. However,
with regard to religion, they are inclined to Iran. As a result, in
Kvemo Kartli, Shi'a Azerbaijan and Shi'a Iran are struggling with
each other. Their struggle for the influence in Kvemo Kartli is a
very complicated issue, as the situation is extremely difficult. The
Iranians seem to be trying to influence the situation there by means
of Azerbaijanis living in Georgia. In addition to it all, Wahhabism
is picking up momentum in Pankisi.
Now let us discuss what happened in the outskirts of Tbilisi. The
place is mainly populated by Shi'a Azerbaijanis. Out of a sudden,
a community is formed there calling itself "Islamic community". They
appealed to the City Hall for a permission to build a prayer house.
Eventually, they received the permission. The fact caused indignation
among the local Shi'a population, which is natural, as Wahhabism is
absolutely unacceptable to them. When I saw the document, which was
published by your newspaper, too, I read a very interesting piece of
information there. The City Hall gave a building permit to a corporate
entity. This means that it cannot be a private house as the City Hall
is trying to say in self-defence that they gave a permit to build a
private house. This is a building given to a corporate entity. In
reality, they are building a mosque. The main thing is that the
City Hall did it intentionally aiming to bring more tensions to the
situation, or they gave permission out of ignorance. If you know
nothing, why do you give permission? After all, it was possible to
ask others... [Ellipsis as published] The head of the organization is
Mufti Kamil Mamedov. Shi'ism knows no term like this. He is a shaykh.
Situations like this should be approached with caution. This is not
a certain harmless sect, whose existence causes no problems. This
is a Wahhabi organization. Wahhabism has taken on in Kvemo Kartli
in a creeping format. I have always said that the Pankisi Gorge was
a stepping stone and it would by all means go on. We can see the
results brought about by Wahhabism in the North Caucasus. The first
thing Wahhabis did was to start a struggle against the followers of
local Islam. Immediately after beating them, they went on to struggle
against secular forces. Therefore, it all constitutes a really serious
danger for the country. Incidentally, our Western partners disapprove
of the fact that we pay no attention to all this.
[Samkharadze] Yes, but Wahhabism in Kvemo Kartli and the whole of
Georgia is controlled by the security service, is it not?
[Areshidze] Control is not enough. You should be well aware of the
different denominations existing in Islam and you should not only
control, but should know who is backed by whom, so as to be able
to settle the situation. Just control is not enough in a situation
like this.
Neighbouring countries struggling for influence in Georgia
[Samkharadze] The following headline appeared in the Azerbaijani
media: "Iran is going to hit Azerbaijan from Borchalo [old name of the
Azeri-populated area in Georgia adjacent to Azerbaijan". It drew a huge
response outside this country. According to the article, the Ahlul-Bayt
[descendants of Prophet Muhammad] organization in Georgia is busy
popularizing Iran. Finances were allocated for the 2012 parliamentary
election in support of several [ethnic] Azeris to become MPs. One of
them succeeded in becoming an MP via the Georgian Dream party. Money
was transferred for popularizing Iran and thousands of young people
from Borchalo were sent to Iran to study. In Tbilisi, Ahlul-Bayt
built an office on the money received from Iran. What is going on,
Batono [Georgian polite form of addressing man] Mamuka? What office
is it and what are its functions? We know that the United States
is getting ready to hit Iran. Meanwhile, Iranian organizations are
founded in Tbilisi and carrying out their work.
[Areshidze] Moscow is interested in replacing [Azeri President Ilham]
Aliyev's regime. For this reason, a club of billionaires was founded
in Moscow, its members being Moscow-based [ethnic] Azeri billionaires.
This club [Ahlul-Bayt] was founded with their help. The club is also
known as Azerross [Azerbaijan and Russia]. Their aim is to struggle
for influence. Can you see what is going on in Kvemo Kartli? Shi'as,
Sunnis, Wahhabis, plus the billionaires' club are all struggling for
influence. In fact, this is a running process. I do not know how well
the security service is controlling it. It looked as if the processes
were under control in previous years. However, it is a fact that these
groupings have consolidated and enlarged. The office of Ahlul-Bayt is
located in Tbilisi, at 14, Zhani Kalandadze St. It is a humanitarian
organization, to be more precise, an Islamic educational organization.
It would be a lie to say that the organization was spotted to be
carrying out activities against the state. I would also like to add
that the Iranians are being very delicate towards Georgia. But as
regards the [ethnic] Azeris living in Georgia, they are doing their
best to use these people for the interest of their own influence.
[Ethnic] Azeris living in Georgia are not distinguished by their
religious devoutness. If the processes were deep, I would not be
giving you an interview. Instead, I would be shouting in respective
[government] offices. I am giving you this interview since I know
that things can be remedied at the public level.
Despite the fact that Iran is indeed being delicate towards Georgia,
all countries are making efforts to gain influence in this country.
These are Russia, the United States, Turkey, Iran and even our
neighbour Armenia. Everyone is struggling for influence; some have
interests in Georgia. We are the only imbeciles. We even fail to
organize our disaporas in Russia, Turkey or the North Caucasus,
not to mention other countries.
Muslim prayer house likely to be turned into storehouse of weapons
[Samkharadze] Yet, a mosque it being built in Ponichala. Can you tell
us what particular threats might it pose.
[Areshidze] The mosque has not been completed yet: Only the walls
and the dome have been built. I would like to say that I am not and
will never be against constructing mosques. It is not this particular
mosque that constitutes a danger, but a likely confrontation between
local Shi'as and Wahhabis to take place on our territory in case
Wahhabis turn this prayer house of Islam into their outpost. Today,
it is going to be an educational centre. Tomorrow, it will become a
place for political debates. The day after tomorrow, it will be used
to store weapons. Chechnya and Dagestan have already gone through it.
On the whole, I would like to say that if Islam exists in Georgia, it
means that it is part of the Georgian religious culture. And if so,
[our] young people should not be going abroad to study, but should
be capable of receiving education in Georgia. Similarly to Christian
youths getting education in ecclesiastic schools, Muslim youths should
be studying in madrasahs built in Georgia. To sum up, I would like to
urge the Georgian authorities to pay due attention to the issue. In
addition, the Muslim administration of Georgia should undergo a serious
reorganization. This is what our Muslim population insists, on so that
people like Vagip Akperov, who is a nonentity and enjoys no authority,
does not become chief shaykh. He was attached to the security [service]
of the former government, and now resides in the Tbilisi mosque and
does not allow anyone to enter it. This is why other centres emerge
in Azeri villages, uncontrollable centres and religious houses.
[Translated from Georgian]