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IN QUOTES: TORONTO CITY COUNCILLORS ON DEFERRING ARMENIAN GENOCIDE MEMORIAL
Toronto Star
April 23 2014
The executive committee voted Wednesday to force bureaucrats and the
next batch of councillors to figure out how to respond to a contentious
memorial request.
By: Daniel Dale City Hall, Published on Wed Apr 23 2014
Council's executive committee voted Wednesday to force city bureaucrats
and the next batch of councillors to figure out how to respond to
a contentious request for a privately funded memorial, on public
property, to the 1915 Ottoman genocide of the Armenian minority.
Deputy Mayor Norm Kelly, a former history teacher, wanted the memorial
approved. But the request faced strong and emotional opposition from
members of the local Turkish community, who, like the government of
Turkey, reject the scholarly consensus that a genocide indeed occurred.
Turkish-Canadian residents packed the committee room. They told the
councillors that no court has delivered a verdict of genocide, that
Armenians also committed human rights abuses, and that a memorial
would foster acrimony and lead to Turkish children being bullied in
city schools.
The committee then voted 8-1 in favour of a proposal from Councillor
Giorgio Mammoliti to ask city officials to report back in 2015 --
after the election -- after seeking input from the two communities
and the provincial and federal governments.
Councillor Shelley Carroll, who sought approval for the donated
memorial on behalf of the local Armenian community, said the community
wanted to commemorate the 100-year anniversary of the beginning of
the genocide in April 2015. She said the deferral means the memorial
will now be approved "on the 12th of never."
Mayor Rob Ford skipped most of the debate and did not speak on the
issue. Some of the comments made by other members of the committee:
Councillor Peter Leon: "We've come a long way since this unfortunate
mishap occurred in that historical time. And we've come a long way
with other unfortunate issues that happened after that. Toronto is
truly unique because we get along with each other."
Councillor Anthony Perruzza: "When we first immigrated here -- I
come from central Italy. You will know that in Italy, there's a lot
of animosity, and a lot of history, between the north and the south,
between different clans, in the different regions of the country. But
you know, when we came here -- we were living on a street called St.
Lucie -- and along that street there were a lot of Italians. There
were Italians from northern Italy, Italians from southern Italy,
and all of those other different factions, and I've got to tell you,
when it was wine-making time, they collaborated. They collaborated
. . . to make sausages and soppressata, some prosciutto and so on,
and vice-versa.
So what we brought here to this country, yes is our diversity --
but not our intolerance. What we left in check at the door was our
animosity towards each other."
Councillor Giorgio Mammoliti: "I've never favoured giving any of our
parks to any organizations, be it for a dollar, be it for any donation
-- you'll recall the nudist beach issue, where I was infamous for
taking off my shirt. There was a reason for it -- I didn't want to
give it to the nudists for a dollar a year. And until I took off my
shirt, it wasn't as controversial as this issue."
"I'm sorry I don't know international law. But I'm a councillor,
for crying out loud, who makes $105,000 a year ... so I apologize
that I don't know, Mr. Chairman, I apologize for that; I apologize if
I've upset anybody. But I was elected to cut grass, fill potholes,
make sure our curbs are in place, and to make sure my constituents
are happy with the municipal level of government."
Councillor Frank Di Giorgio: "Trying to put it in context for myself,
I think when one speaks of the Holocaust, I don't think there seems to
be, historically, any disagreement, or at least any points of debate,
as to whether an issue, the Holocaust actually occurred and in the
numbers it did occur. The analogy that comes forward for me, with
respect to the Armenian situation, is, and I don't want to bring this
up again, is the situation of apartheid that we dealt with ...you know,
'is this really apartheid' and all those kind of things, where there
seemed to be some conflicting views as to whether something actually
exists currently ... so the debate I'm looking at today is in that
vein and not so much a comparison to the Holocaust, for me." (Di
Giorgio clarified in a post-meeting interview that he was referring
not to South African Apartheid, about which there is no dispute,
but to the debate about the phrase "Israeli apartheid," which has
been considered by council in the context of the Pride parade.)
http://www.thestar.com/news/city_hall/2014/04/23/in_quotes_toronto_city_councillors_on_deferring_ar menian_genocide_memorial.html
From: A. Papazian
Toronto Star
April 23 2014
The executive committee voted Wednesday to force bureaucrats and the
next batch of councillors to figure out how to respond to a contentious
memorial request.
By: Daniel Dale City Hall, Published on Wed Apr 23 2014
Council's executive committee voted Wednesday to force city bureaucrats
and the next batch of councillors to figure out how to respond to
a contentious request for a privately funded memorial, on public
property, to the 1915 Ottoman genocide of the Armenian minority.
Deputy Mayor Norm Kelly, a former history teacher, wanted the memorial
approved. But the request faced strong and emotional opposition from
members of the local Turkish community, who, like the government of
Turkey, reject the scholarly consensus that a genocide indeed occurred.
Turkish-Canadian residents packed the committee room. They told the
councillors that no court has delivered a verdict of genocide, that
Armenians also committed human rights abuses, and that a memorial
would foster acrimony and lead to Turkish children being bullied in
city schools.
The committee then voted 8-1 in favour of a proposal from Councillor
Giorgio Mammoliti to ask city officials to report back in 2015 --
after the election -- after seeking input from the two communities
and the provincial and federal governments.
Councillor Shelley Carroll, who sought approval for the donated
memorial on behalf of the local Armenian community, said the community
wanted to commemorate the 100-year anniversary of the beginning of
the genocide in April 2015. She said the deferral means the memorial
will now be approved "on the 12th of never."
Mayor Rob Ford skipped most of the debate and did not speak on the
issue. Some of the comments made by other members of the committee:
Councillor Peter Leon: "We've come a long way since this unfortunate
mishap occurred in that historical time. And we've come a long way
with other unfortunate issues that happened after that. Toronto is
truly unique because we get along with each other."
Councillor Anthony Perruzza: "When we first immigrated here -- I
come from central Italy. You will know that in Italy, there's a lot
of animosity, and a lot of history, between the north and the south,
between different clans, in the different regions of the country. But
you know, when we came here -- we were living on a street called St.
Lucie -- and along that street there were a lot of Italians. There
were Italians from northern Italy, Italians from southern Italy,
and all of those other different factions, and I've got to tell you,
when it was wine-making time, they collaborated. They collaborated
. . . to make sausages and soppressata, some prosciutto and so on,
and vice-versa.
So what we brought here to this country, yes is our diversity --
but not our intolerance. What we left in check at the door was our
animosity towards each other."
Councillor Giorgio Mammoliti: "I've never favoured giving any of our
parks to any organizations, be it for a dollar, be it for any donation
-- you'll recall the nudist beach issue, where I was infamous for
taking off my shirt. There was a reason for it -- I didn't want to
give it to the nudists for a dollar a year. And until I took off my
shirt, it wasn't as controversial as this issue."
"I'm sorry I don't know international law. But I'm a councillor,
for crying out loud, who makes $105,000 a year ... so I apologize
that I don't know, Mr. Chairman, I apologize for that; I apologize if
I've upset anybody. But I was elected to cut grass, fill potholes,
make sure our curbs are in place, and to make sure my constituents
are happy with the municipal level of government."
Councillor Frank Di Giorgio: "Trying to put it in context for myself,
I think when one speaks of the Holocaust, I don't think there seems to
be, historically, any disagreement, or at least any points of debate,
as to whether an issue, the Holocaust actually occurred and in the
numbers it did occur. The analogy that comes forward for me, with
respect to the Armenian situation, is, and I don't want to bring this
up again, is the situation of apartheid that we dealt with ...you know,
'is this really apartheid' and all those kind of things, where there
seemed to be some conflicting views as to whether something actually
exists currently ... so the debate I'm looking at today is in that
vein and not so much a comparison to the Holocaust, for me." (Di
Giorgio clarified in a post-meeting interview that he was referring
not to South African Apartheid, about which there is no dispute,
but to the debate about the phrase "Israeli apartheid," which has
been considered by council in the context of the Pride parade.)
http://www.thestar.com/news/city_hall/2014/04/23/in_quotes_toronto_city_councillors_on_deferring_ar menian_genocide_memorial.html
From: A. Papazian